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        <title>Deviate with Rolf Potts</title>
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        <description>Conversations about travel and culture (and everything else)</description>
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        <copyright>© 2026 Rolf Potts</copyright>
        
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                <title>Deviate with Rolf Potts</title>
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                <itunes:subtitle>Conversations about travel and culture (and everything else)</itunes:subtitle>
        <itunes:author>Rolf Potts</itunes:author>
        <itunes:type>episodic</itunes:type>
        <itunes:summary>Conversations about travel and culture (and everything else)</itunes:summary>
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            <itunes:name>Rolf Potts</itunes:name>
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                <title>
                    <![CDATA[How philosophy can (truly) improve your life, featuring Monica McCarthy]]>
                </title>
                <pubDate>Wed, 08 May 2019 00:01:30 +0000</pubDate>
                <dc:creator>Rolf Potts</dc:creator>
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                                <description>
                                            <![CDATA[<em>“The challenge is that we have to become philosophers ourselves, in a way. We have to learn to ask better questions and more questions than we had to before.”</em> – Monica McCarthy

Monica McCarthy (<a href="https://twitter.com/missmmccarthy?lang=en">@MissMMcCarthy</a>) is an actress, writer, and host of <a href="https://www.thehappierhour.org/">The Happier Hour</a> podcast and live show, which aims to make philosophy useful and accessible. For more about Monica, you can check our her <a href="https://www.monicamccarthy.net/">website</a> or watch her TedX talk, <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=seARHjX8_sg">Philosophy: The Life Hack of the Future</a>.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf speaks with Monica about the “definition” of philosophy (3:00); where people should start when seeking to embrace philosophy (16:00); travel as a metaphor for discussing philosophy (22:00); Western philosophy and common assumptions about it (32:00); and key takeaways from Monica's podcast (50:00).

<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tim_Ferriss">Tim Ferriss</a> (author / entrepreneur)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ryan_Holiday">Ryan Holiday</a> (author)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alain_de_Botton">Alain de Botton</a> (author / philosopher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socrates">Socrates</a> (philosopher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S%C3%B8ren_Kierkegaard">Søren Kierkegaard</a> (philosopher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ludwig_Wittgenstein">Ludwig Wittgenstein</a> (philosopher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simone_de_Beauvoir">Simone de Beauvoir</a> (philosopher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean-Paul_Sartre">Jean-Paul Sartre</a> (philosopher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friedrich_Nietzsche">Friedrich Nietzsche</a> (philosopher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Camus">Albert Camus</a> (philosopher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Hume">David Hume</a> (philosopher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epicurus">Epicurus</a> (philosopher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avicenna">Avicenna</a> (philosopher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stoicism">Stoicism</a> (school of philosophy)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Existentialism">Existentialism</a> (school of philosophy)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nero">Nero</a> (Roman emperor)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Massimo_Pigliucci">Massimo Pigliucci</a> (professor of Philosophy at CUNY-City College)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.amazon.com/At-Existentialist-Caf%C3%A9-Freedom-Cocktails/dp/1536617474">At the Existentialist Café</a>, by Sarah Bakewell (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Good_Place">The Good Place</a> (television show)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trolley_problem">Trolley Problem</a> (thought experiment)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_School_of_Life">The School of Life</a> (educational company)</li>
</ul>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
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                    <![CDATA[“The challenge is that we have to become philosophers ourselves, in a way. We have to learn to ask better questions and more questions than we had to before.” – Monica McCarthy

Monica McCarthy (@MissMMcCarthy) is an actress, writer, and host of The Happier Hour podcast and live show, which aims to make philosophy useful and accessible. For more about Monica, you can check our her website or watch her TedX talk, Philosophy: The Life Hack of the Future.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf speaks with Monica about the “definition” of philosophy (3:00); where people should start when seeking to embrace philosophy (16:00); travel as a metaphor for discussing philosophy (22:00); Western philosophy and common assumptions about it (32:00); and key takeaways from Monica's podcast (50:00).

Notable Links:

 	Tim Ferriss (author / entrepreneur)
 	Ryan Holiday (author)
 	Alain de Botton (author / philosopher)
 	Socrates (philosopher)
 	Søren Kierkegaard (philosopher)
 	Ludwig Wittgenstein (philosopher)
 	Simone de Beauvoir (philosopher)
 	Jean-Paul Sartre (philosopher)
 	Friedrich Nietzsche (philosopher)
 	Albert Camus (philosopher)
 	David Hume (philosopher)
 	Epicurus (philosopher)
 	Avicenna (philosopher)
 	Stoicism (school of philosophy)
 	Existentialism (school of philosophy)
 	Nero (Roman emperor)
 	Massimo Pigliucci (professor of Philosophy at CUNY-City College)
 	At the Existentialist Café, by Sarah Bakewell (book)
 	The Good Place (television show)
 	Trolley Problem (thought experiment)
 	The School of Life (educational company)

The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album Lumber.

Note: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </itunes:subtitle>
                                <itunes:title>
                    <![CDATA[How philosophy can (truly) improve your life, featuring Monica McCarthy]]>
                </itunes:title>
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                <content:encoded>
                    <![CDATA[<em>“The challenge is that we have to become philosophers ourselves, in a way. We have to learn to ask better questions and more questions than we had to before.”</em> – Monica McCarthy

Monica McCarthy (<a href="https://twitter.com/missmmccarthy?lang=en">@MissMMcCarthy</a>) is an actress, writer, and host of <a href="https://www.thehappierhour.org/">The Happier Hour</a> podcast and live show, which aims to make philosophy useful and accessible. For more about Monica, you can check our her <a href="https://www.monicamccarthy.net/">website</a> or watch her TedX talk, <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=seARHjX8_sg">Philosophy: The Life Hack of the Future</a>.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf speaks with Monica about the “definition” of philosophy (3:00); where people should start when seeking to embrace philosophy (16:00); travel as a metaphor for discussing philosophy (22:00); Western philosophy and common assumptions about it (32:00); and key takeaways from Monica's podcast (50:00).

<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tim_Ferriss">Tim Ferriss</a> (author / entrepreneur)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ryan_Holiday">Ryan Holiday</a> (author)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alain_de_Botton">Alain de Botton</a> (author / philosopher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socrates">Socrates</a> (philosopher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S%C3%B8ren_Kierkegaard">Søren Kierkegaard</a> (philosopher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ludwig_Wittgenstein">Ludwig Wittgenstein</a> (philosopher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simone_de_Beauvoir">Simone de Beauvoir</a> (philosopher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean-Paul_Sartre">Jean-Paul Sartre</a> (philosopher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friedrich_Nietzsche">Friedrich Nietzsche</a> (philosopher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Camus">Albert Camus</a> (philosopher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Hume">David Hume</a> (philosopher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epicurus">Epicurus</a> (philosopher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avicenna">Avicenna</a> (philosopher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stoicism">Stoicism</a> (school of philosophy)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Existentialism">Existentialism</a> (school of philosophy)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nero">Nero</a> (Roman emperor)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Massimo_Pigliucci">Massimo Pigliucci</a> (professor of Philosophy at CUNY-City College)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.amazon.com/At-Existentialist-Caf%C3%A9-Freedom-Cocktails/dp/1536617474">At the Existentialist Café</a>, by Sarah Bakewell (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Good_Place">The Good Place</a> (television show)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trolley_problem">Trolley Problem</a> (thought experiment)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_School_of_Life">The School of Life</a> (educational company)</li>
</ul>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
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                                <itunes:summary>
                    <![CDATA[“The challenge is that we have to become philosophers ourselves, in a way. We have to learn to ask better questions and more questions than we had to before.” – Monica McCarthy

Monica McCarthy (@MissMMcCarthy) is an actress, writer, and host of The Happier Hour podcast and live show, which aims to make philosophy useful and accessible. For more about Monica, you can check our her website or watch her TedX talk, Philosophy: The Life Hack of the Future.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf speaks with Monica about the “definition” of philosophy (3:00); where people should start when seeking to embrace philosophy (16:00); travel as a metaphor for discussing philosophy (22:00); Western philosophy and common assumptions about it (32:00); and key takeaways from Monica's podcast (50:00).

Notable Links:

 	Tim Ferriss (author / entrepreneur)
 	Ryan Holiday (author)
 	Alain de Botton (author / philosopher)
 	Socrates (philosopher)
 	Søren Kierkegaard (philosopher)
 	Ludwig Wittgenstein (philosopher)
 	Simone de Beauvoir (philosopher)
 	Jean-Paul Sartre (philosopher)
 	Friedrich Nietzsche (philosopher)
 	Albert Camus (philosopher)
 	David Hume (philosopher)
 	Epicurus (philosopher)
 	Avicenna (philosopher)
 	Stoicism (school of philosophy)
 	Existentialism (school of philosophy)
 	Nero (Roman emperor)
 	Massimo Pigliucci (professor of Philosophy at CUNY-City College)
 	At the Existentialist Café, by Sarah Bakewell (book)
 	The Good Place (television show)
 	Trolley Problem (thought experiment)
 	The School of Life (educational company)

The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album Lumber.

Note: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </itunes:summary>
                                                                            <itunes:duration>00:54:07</itunes:duration>
                                                    <itunes:author>
                    <![CDATA[Rolf Potts]]>
                </itunes:author>
                            </item>
                    <item>
                <title>
                    <![CDATA[Deviate Season One finale with Ari Shaffir]]>
                </title>
                <pubDate>Tue, 13 Nov 2018 00:01:03 +0000</pubDate>
                <dc:creator>Rolf Potts</dc:creator>
                <guid isPermaLink="true">
                    https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/podcasts/2160/episodes/deviate-season-one-finale-with-ari-shaffir</guid>
                                    <link>https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/episodes/deviate-season-one-finale-with-ari-shaffir</link>
                                <description>
                                            <![CDATA[<em>“The hashtag level of social media discourse can be really frustrating. It tends to bend narratives toward the hashtag slogan. But when we start sweeping everything into the same category, we begin to trivialize the core issue.”</em> – Rolf Potts

Ari Shaffir (<a href="https://www.instagram.com/arishaffir/">@AriShaffir</a>) is a comedian, writer, podcaster, and actor. He is the current host of the podcast <a href="http://arishaffir.com/category/podcast/">Skeptic Tank</a>.

In the Season 1 Finale of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and Ari resume their conversation about magic mushrooms (7:00); discuss Ari’s strange bets and the experience of panhandling for money (17:00); reflect on lessons learned from the past year of podcasting (32:00); discuss the shortcomings of travel television (55:00); and explore self-mythology and society’s over-simplification of complex topics (1:07:00).

This episode of Deviate is brought to you by <a href="https://www.airtreks.com/deviate">AirTreks</a>, an industry leader in multi-stop international travel. If you’ve ever planned a trip with multiple stops, you know that finding the right flights can be difficult. Airtreks can help with your international flight planning, specializing in complex routes with up to 25 stops. The Airtreks website offers suggested pre-planned travel itineraries to help you get started, and can customize to fit your journey.

Visit <a href="https://www.airtreks.com/deviate/">https://www.airtreks.com/deviate/</a> and get a signed copy of <em>Vagabonding</em> when you book your first trip with Airtreks.
<p class="p1"><span style="text-decoration:underline;"><span class="s1">Deviate episodes mentioned</span></span></p>

<ul class="ul1">
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/tim-ferriss/"><span class="s3">Bestselling author Tim Ferriss on how to create a successful podcast</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/ari-shaffir/"><span class="s3">Comedian Ari Shaffir on ‘shrooms, hugging, and quitting smartphones</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/ari-shaffir-souvenirs/"><span class="s3">Ari Shaffir on travel, memory, and the odd psychology of souvenirs</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/satanic-backward-masking/"><span class="s3">Satanic backward masking changed 1980s rock (but not in the way you think)</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/black-police/"><span class="s3">What it’s like to be a black police officer in America</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/latino-police/"><span class="s3">What it’s like to be a Latino police officer in America</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/national-anthem/"><span class="s3">The weird and complicated history of America’s national anthem</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/ian-mackaye/"><span class="s3">Punk icon Ian MacKaye on why we should question the official history of rock music</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/best-places-to-live/"><span class="s3">Celebrating the best places to live (and the quest for home) in America</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/dulcinea-pitagora/"><span class="s3">Kink Doctor Dulcinea Pitagora on sex therapy, BDSM, and dominatrix work</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/reinventing-agricuture/"><span class="s3">The way we grow food has been broken for 10,000 years (but we can fix it)</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/p..."></a></span></li></ul>]]>
                                    </description>
                <itunes:subtitle>
                    <![CDATA[“The hashtag level of social media discourse can be really frustrating. It tends to bend narratives toward the hashtag slogan. But when we start sweeping everything into the same category, we begin to trivialize the core issue.” – Rolf Potts

Ari Shaffir (@AriShaffir) is a comedian, writer, podcaster, and actor. He is the current host of the podcast Skeptic Tank.

In the Season 1 Finale of Deviate, Rolf and Ari resume their conversation about magic mushrooms (7:00); discuss Ari’s strange bets and the experience of panhandling for money (17:00); reflect on lessons learned from the past year of podcasting (32:00); discuss the shortcomings of travel television (55:00); and explore self-mythology and society’s over-simplification of complex topics (1:07:00).

This episode of Deviate is brought to you by AirTreks, an industry leader in multi-stop international travel. If you’ve ever planned a trip with multiple stops, you know that finding the right flights can be difficult. Airtreks can help with your international flight planning, specializing in complex routes with up to 25 stops. The Airtreks website offers suggested pre-planned travel itineraries to help you get started, and can customize to fit your journey.

Visit https://www.airtreks.com/deviate/ and get a signed copy of Vagabonding when you book your first trip with Airtreks.
Deviate episodes mentioned


 	Bestselling author Tim Ferriss on how to create a successful podcast
 	Comedian Ari Shaffir on ‘shrooms, hugging, and quitting smartphones
 	Ari Shaffir on travel, memory, and the odd psychology of souvenirs
 	Satanic backward masking changed 1980s rock (but not in the way you think)
 	What it’s like to be a black police officer in America
 	What it’s like to be a Latino police officer in America
 	The weird and complicated history of America’s national anthem
 	Punk icon Ian MacKaye on why we should question the official history of rock music
 	Celebrating the best places to live (and the quest for home) in America
 	Kink Doctor Dulcinea Pitagora on sex therapy, BDSM, and dominatrix work
 	The way we grow food has been broken for 10,000 years (but we can fix it)
 	]]>
                </itunes:subtitle>
                                <itunes:title>
                    <![CDATA[Deviate Season One finale with Ari Shaffir]]>
                </itunes:title>
                                                <itunes:explicit>false</itunes:explicit>
                <content:encoded>
                    <![CDATA[<em>“The hashtag level of social media discourse can be really frustrating. It tends to bend narratives toward the hashtag slogan. But when we start sweeping everything into the same category, we begin to trivialize the core issue.”</em> – Rolf Potts

Ari Shaffir (<a href="https://www.instagram.com/arishaffir/">@AriShaffir</a>) is a comedian, writer, podcaster, and actor. He is the current host of the podcast <a href="http://arishaffir.com/category/podcast/">Skeptic Tank</a>.

In the Season 1 Finale of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and Ari resume their conversation about magic mushrooms (7:00); discuss Ari’s strange bets and the experience of panhandling for money (17:00); reflect on lessons learned from the past year of podcasting (32:00); discuss the shortcomings of travel television (55:00); and explore self-mythology and society’s over-simplification of complex topics (1:07:00).

This episode of Deviate is brought to you by <a href="https://www.airtreks.com/deviate">AirTreks</a>, an industry leader in multi-stop international travel. If you’ve ever planned a trip with multiple stops, you know that finding the right flights can be difficult. Airtreks can help with your international flight planning, specializing in complex routes with up to 25 stops. The Airtreks website offers suggested pre-planned travel itineraries to help you get started, and can customize to fit your journey.

Visit <a href="https://www.airtreks.com/deviate/">https://www.airtreks.com/deviate/</a> and get a signed copy of <em>Vagabonding</em> when you book your first trip with Airtreks.
<p class="p1"><span style="text-decoration:underline;"><span class="s1">Deviate episodes mentioned</span></span></p>

<ul class="ul1">
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/tim-ferriss/"><span class="s3">Bestselling author Tim Ferriss on how to create a successful podcast</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/ari-shaffir/"><span class="s3">Comedian Ari Shaffir on ‘shrooms, hugging, and quitting smartphones</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/ari-shaffir-souvenirs/"><span class="s3">Ari Shaffir on travel, memory, and the odd psychology of souvenirs</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/satanic-backward-masking/"><span class="s3">Satanic backward masking changed 1980s rock (but not in the way you think)</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/black-police/"><span class="s3">What it’s like to be a black police officer in America</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/latino-police/"><span class="s3">What it’s like to be a Latino police officer in America</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/national-anthem/"><span class="s3">The weird and complicated history of America’s national anthem</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/ian-mackaye/"><span class="s3">Punk icon Ian MacKaye on why we should question the official history of rock music</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/best-places-to-live/"><span class="s3">Celebrating the best places to live (and the quest for home) in America</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/dulcinea-pitagora/"><span class="s3">Kink Doctor Dulcinea Pitagora on sex therapy, BDSM, and dominatrix work</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/reinventing-agricuture/"><span class="s3">The way we grow food has been broken for 10,000 years (but we can fix it)</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/deviate-live/"><span class="s3">Deviate Live in New York City: Travel Stories and Souvenirs</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/j-yuenger-white-zombie/"><span class="s3">White Zombie guitarist J. Yuenger on music, expat life, and long-term travel</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/kevin-kelly/"><span class="s3">Kevin Kelly on the lost world of 1970s Asia (and why you should travel now)</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/andrew-mccarthy/"><span class="s3">Andrew McCarthy on storytelling, celebrity, and how travel changed his life</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/paul-theroux/"><span class="s3">Paul Theroux on the art of listening, and the necessary obstacles of deep travel</span></a></span></li>
</ul>
<p class="p1"><span style="text-decoration:underline;"><span class="s1">Other links</span></span></p>

<ul class="ul1">
 	<li class="li1"><span class="s4"><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/20,000_Days_on_Earth"><span class="s5">20,000 Days On Earth</span></a></span> (Nick Cave documentary)</li>
 	<li class="li1"><span class="s4"><a href="https://amzn.to/2JMcury"><span class="s5">The Fountainhead</span></a></span>, by Ayn Rand (book)</li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Museum_of_Jurassic_Technology"><span class="s3">Museum of Jurassic Technology</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celebrity_Centres"><span class="s3">Scientology Center</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="http://podcasts.joerogan.net/"><span class="s3">Joe Rogan podcast</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li1"><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/henry-rollins-travel-slideshow/">Henry Rollins Travel Slideshow</a></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://allthingscomedy.com/podcast/punch-drunk"><span class="s3">Punch Drunk Sports</span></a></span><span class="s6"> (podcast)</span></li>
 	<li class="li3"><span class="s2"><a href="https://www.calfussman.com/podcast/"><span class="s3">Cal Fussman podcast</span></a></span></li>
 	<li class="li1"><span class="s4"><a href="https://tim.blog/2018/10/11/paul-stamets/"><span class="s5">How Mushrooms Can Save You</span></a></span> (Tim Ferriss podcast episode)</li>
 	<li class="li1"><span class="s4"><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/B%C3%B2_l%C3%BAc_l%E1%BA%AFc"><span class="s5">Lok lak</span></a></span> (Cambodian beef dish)</li>
 	<li class="li1"><span class="s4"><a href="https://www.osprey.com/"><span class="s5">Osprey</span></a></span> (backpack brand)</li>
 	<li class="li1"><span class="s4"><a href="https://www.tortugabackpacks.com/"><span class="s5">Tortuga</span></a></span> (backpack brand)</li>
 	<li class="li1"><span class="s4"><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blundstone_Footwear"><span class="s5">Blundstone</span></a></span> (footwear company)</li>
 	<li class="li1"><span class="s4"><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evan_Williams_(bourbon)"><span class="s5">Evan Williams</span></a></span> (bourbon brand)</li>
</ul>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </content:encoded>
                                    <enclosure url="https://episodes.castos.com/deviate/Deviate-052-Shaffir.mp3" length=""
                        type="audio/mpeg">
                    </enclosure>
                                <itunes:summary>
                    <![CDATA[“The hashtag level of social media discourse can be really frustrating. It tends to bend narratives toward the hashtag slogan. But when we start sweeping everything into the same category, we begin to trivialize the core issue.” – Rolf Potts

Ari Shaffir (@AriShaffir) is a comedian, writer, podcaster, and actor. He is the current host of the podcast Skeptic Tank.

In the Season 1 Finale of Deviate, Rolf and Ari resume their conversation about magic mushrooms (7:00); discuss Ari’s strange bets and the experience of panhandling for money (17:00); reflect on lessons learned from the past year of podcasting (32:00); discuss the shortcomings of travel television (55:00); and explore self-mythology and society’s over-simplification of complex topics (1:07:00).

This episode of Deviate is brought to you by AirTreks, an industry leader in multi-stop international travel. If you’ve ever planned a trip with multiple stops, you know that finding the right flights can be difficult. Airtreks can help with your international flight planning, specializing in complex routes with up to 25 stops. The Airtreks website offers suggested pre-planned travel itineraries to help you get started, and can customize to fit your journey.

Visit https://www.airtreks.com/deviate/ and get a signed copy of Vagabonding when you book your first trip with Airtreks.
Deviate episodes mentioned


 	Bestselling author Tim Ferriss on how to create a successful podcast
 	Comedian Ari Shaffir on ‘shrooms, hugging, and quitting smartphones
 	Ari Shaffir on travel, memory, and the odd psychology of souvenirs
 	Satanic backward masking changed 1980s rock (but not in the way you think)
 	What it’s like to be a black police officer in America
 	What it’s like to be a Latino police officer in America
 	The weird and complicated history of America’s national anthem
 	Punk icon Ian MacKaye on why we should question the official history of rock music
 	Celebrating the best places to live (and the quest for home) in America
 	Kink Doctor Dulcinea Pitagora on sex therapy, BDSM, and dominatrix work
 	The way we grow food has been broken for 10,000 years (but we can fix it)
 	]]>
                </itunes:summary>
                                                                            <itunes:duration>01:30:52</itunes:duration>
                                                    <itunes:author>
                    <![CDATA[Rolf Potts]]>
                </itunes:author>
                            </item>
                    <item>
                <title>
                    <![CDATA[An outsider's inside history of the Beat Generation, as told by Charles Plymell]]>
                </title>
                <pubDate>Tue, 06 Nov 2018 00:01:52 +0000</pubDate>
                <dc:creator>Rolf Potts</dc:creator>
                <guid isPermaLink="true">
                    https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/podcasts/2160/episodes/an-outsiders-inside-history-of-the-beat-generation-as-told-by-charles-plymell</guid>
                                    <link>https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/episodes/an-outsiders-inside-history-of-the-beat-generation-as-told-by-charles-plymell</link>
                                <description>
                                            <![CDATA[<em>"To me the term Beat was like, "Hey man I'm beat," after all night on Benzedrine. I never considered myself a Beat. But my first book was published by Ferlinghetti and they all arrived at my doorstep when I lived at Gough Street, so I guess I became a Beat by osmosis."</em> —Charles Plymell

<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Plymell">Charles Plymell</a> is a poet, novelist, and small press publisher. Plymell has collaborated with and published many poets, writers, and artists, including principals of the Beat Generation. <em><a href="https://amzn.to/2OoDUED">Benzedrine Highway</a></em>, published in 2013, is an anthology of his best-known poetry and prose, including excerpts from his 1971 City Lights novel <em><a href="https://amzn.to/2F0CmRW">The Last of the Moccasins</a></em>.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Charles and his wife Pamela Beach Plymell discuss their memories of (and interactions with) Jack Kerouac (4:55); Charley's upbringing in Dust Bowl-era Kansas, and his early road-trips to California (11:05); life as a young hood and hipster in Wichita (14:40); meeting and interacting with the Beats in San Francisco (19:20); rooming with Neal Cassady and Allen Ginsberg when Cassady was trying to write his own book (23:55); hosting Ginsberg during the poet's Wichita Vortex Sutra journey to Kansas in 1966 (30:50); publishing the first issue of R. Crumb's Zap Comix just before the Summer of Love (35:35); working at a teamster on the San Francisco docks, and getting his own novel published (39:50); and interacting with William S. Burroughs in the later years of the author's life (46:00).

For more information on Charley, check out his fan page at <a href="http://hipsterfansite.blogspot.com/">http://hipsterfansite.blogspot.com/</a>.

<u>Notable Links</u>:
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beat_Generation">Beat Generation</a> (literary movement)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_Kerouac">Jack Kerouac</a> (Beat author and poet)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_F._Buckley_Jr.">William F. Buckley Jr.</a> (conservative intellectual)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firing_Line_(TV_series)">Firing Line</a> (public affairs TV show)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Truman_Capote">Truman Capote</a> (author and critic)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2DlHka5">Hand on the Doorknob</a></em>, by Charles Plymell (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Benzedrine">Benzedrine</a> and <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dextroamphetamine">Dexedrine</a> (amphetamine pills)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neal_Cassady">Neal Cassady</a> (Beat Generation personality)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allen_Ginsberg">Allen Ginsberg</a> (Beat poet)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2SMMf8G">The First Third</a></em>, by Neal Cassady (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lawrence_Ferlinghetti">Lawrence Ferlinghetti</a> (poet and publisher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/City_Lights_Bookstore">City Lights</a> (independent bookstore)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wichita_Vortex_Sutra">Wichita Vortex Sutra</a>, by Allen Ginsberg (poem)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://www.thenation.com/article/last-antiwar-poem/">The Last Anti-War Poem</a>," by Rolf Potts (essay)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9NeSJNi0xcM">Wichita Vortex</a> (PBS documentary about the poem)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Crumb">Robert Crumb</a> (underground cartoonist)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zap_Comix">Zap Comix</a> (counterculture comic book series)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Summer_of_Love">Summer of Love</a> (1967 hippie event in San Francisco)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Be-In">Human Be-in</a> (Summer of Love even...</li></ul>]]>
                                    </description>
                <itunes:subtitle>
                    <![CDATA["To me the term Beat was like, "Hey man I'm beat," after all night on Benzedrine. I never considered myself a Beat. But my first book was published by Ferlinghetti and they all arrived at my doorstep when I lived at Gough Street, so I guess I became a Beat by osmosis." —Charles Plymell

Charles Plymell is a poet, novelist, and small press publisher. Plymell has collaborated with and published many poets, writers, and artists, including principals of the Beat Generation. Benzedrine Highway, published in 2013, is an anthology of his best-known poetry and prose, including excerpts from his 1971 City Lights novel The Last of the Moccasins.

In this episode of Deviate, Charles and his wife Pamela Beach Plymell discuss their memories of (and interactions with) Jack Kerouac (4:55); Charley's upbringing in Dust Bowl-era Kansas, and his early road-trips to California (11:05); life as a young hood and hipster in Wichita (14:40); meeting and interacting with the Beats in San Francisco (19:20); rooming with Neal Cassady and Allen Ginsberg when Cassady was trying to write his own book (23:55); hosting Ginsberg during the poet's Wichita Vortex Sutra journey to Kansas in 1966 (30:50); publishing the first issue of R. Crumb's Zap Comix just before the Summer of Love (35:35); working at a teamster on the San Francisco docks, and getting his own novel published (39:50); and interacting with William S. Burroughs in the later years of the author's life (46:00).

For more information on Charley, check out his fan page at http://hipsterfansite.blogspot.com/.

Notable Links:

 	Beat Generation (literary movement)
 	Jack Kerouac (Beat author and poet)
 	William F. Buckley Jr. (conservative intellectual)
 	Firing Line (public affairs TV show)
 	Truman Capote (author and critic)
 	Hand on the Doorknob, by Charles Plymell (book)
 	Benzedrine and Dexedrine (amphetamine pills)
 	Neal Cassady (Beat Generation personality)
 	Allen Ginsberg (Beat poet)
 	The First Third, by Neal Cassady (book)
 	Lawrence Ferlinghetti (poet and publisher)
 	City Lights (independent bookstore)
 	Wichita Vortex Sutra, by Allen Ginsberg (poem)
 	"The Last Anti-War Poem," by Rolf Potts (essay)
 	Wichita Vortex (PBS documentary about the poem)
 	Robert Crumb (underground cartoonist)
 	Zap Comix (counterculture comic book series)
 	Summer of Love (1967 hippie event in San Francisco)
 	Human Be-in (Summer of Love even...]]>
                </itunes:subtitle>
                                <itunes:title>
                    <![CDATA[An outsider's inside history of the Beat Generation, as told by Charles Plymell]]>
                </itunes:title>
                                                <itunes:explicit>false</itunes:explicit>
                <content:encoded>
                    <![CDATA[<em>"To me the term Beat was like, "Hey man I'm beat," after all night on Benzedrine. I never considered myself a Beat. But my first book was published by Ferlinghetti and they all arrived at my doorstep when I lived at Gough Street, so I guess I became a Beat by osmosis."</em> —Charles Plymell

<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Plymell">Charles Plymell</a> is a poet, novelist, and small press publisher. Plymell has collaborated with and published many poets, writers, and artists, including principals of the Beat Generation. <em><a href="https://amzn.to/2OoDUED">Benzedrine Highway</a></em>, published in 2013, is an anthology of his best-known poetry and prose, including excerpts from his 1971 City Lights novel <em><a href="https://amzn.to/2F0CmRW">The Last of the Moccasins</a></em>.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Charles and his wife Pamela Beach Plymell discuss their memories of (and interactions with) Jack Kerouac (4:55); Charley's upbringing in Dust Bowl-era Kansas, and his early road-trips to California (11:05); life as a young hood and hipster in Wichita (14:40); meeting and interacting with the Beats in San Francisco (19:20); rooming with Neal Cassady and Allen Ginsberg when Cassady was trying to write his own book (23:55); hosting Ginsberg during the poet's Wichita Vortex Sutra journey to Kansas in 1966 (30:50); publishing the first issue of R. Crumb's Zap Comix just before the Summer of Love (35:35); working at a teamster on the San Francisco docks, and getting his own novel published (39:50); and interacting with William S. Burroughs in the later years of the author's life (46:00).

For more information on Charley, check out his fan page at <a href="http://hipsterfansite.blogspot.com/">http://hipsterfansite.blogspot.com/</a>.

<u>Notable Links</u>:
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beat_Generation">Beat Generation</a> (literary movement)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_Kerouac">Jack Kerouac</a> (Beat author and poet)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_F._Buckley_Jr.">William F. Buckley Jr.</a> (conservative intellectual)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firing_Line_(TV_series)">Firing Line</a> (public affairs TV show)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Truman_Capote">Truman Capote</a> (author and critic)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2DlHka5">Hand on the Doorknob</a></em>, by Charles Plymell (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Benzedrine">Benzedrine</a> and <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dextroamphetamine">Dexedrine</a> (amphetamine pills)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neal_Cassady">Neal Cassady</a> (Beat Generation personality)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allen_Ginsberg">Allen Ginsberg</a> (Beat poet)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2SMMf8G">The First Third</a></em>, by Neal Cassady (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lawrence_Ferlinghetti">Lawrence Ferlinghetti</a> (poet and publisher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/City_Lights_Bookstore">City Lights</a> (independent bookstore)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wichita_Vortex_Sutra">Wichita Vortex Sutra</a>, by Allen Ginsberg (poem)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://www.thenation.com/article/last-antiwar-poem/">The Last Anti-War Poem</a>," by Rolf Potts (essay)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9NeSJNi0xcM">Wichita Vortex</a> (PBS documentary about the poem)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Crumb">Robert Crumb</a> (underground cartoonist)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zap_Comix">Zap Comix</a> (counterculture comic book series)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Summer_of_Love">Summer of Love</a> (1967 hippie event in San Francisco)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Be-In">Human Be-in</a> (Summer of Love event)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Featherbedding">Featherbedding</a> (hiring practice)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johns_Hopkins_Writing_Seminars">Johns Hopkins Writing Seminars</a> (creative writing program)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_S._Burroughs">William S. Burroughs</a> (writer and artist)</li>
 	<li>The death of <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joan_Vollmer#Death">Joan Vollmer</a> (Burroughs' wife)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macbeth">Macbeth</a> (Shakespeare play)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tomorrow_and_tomorrow_and_tomorrow">Tomorrow and tomorrow and tomorrow</a>" (Macbeth soliloquy)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sonnet_65">Sonnet 65</a> (Shakespeare poem)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_%22Priest%22_They_Called_Him">The "Priest" They Called Him</a>" (Burroughs/Kurt Cobain collaboration)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_oHMFcD7k8s">Nobody Rides For Free</a>" by Grant Hart (music video)</li>
</ul>
<img class="wp-image-7492 aligncenter" src="https://rolfpotts.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/IMG_1043-300x273.jpg" alt="" width="638" height="581" />

<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </content:encoded>
                                    <enclosure url="https://episodes.castos.com/deviate/Deviate-051-Plymell.mp3" length=""
                        type="audio/mpeg">
                    </enclosure>
                                <itunes:summary>
                    <![CDATA["To me the term Beat was like, "Hey man I'm beat," after all night on Benzedrine. I never considered myself a Beat. But my first book was published by Ferlinghetti and they all arrived at my doorstep when I lived at Gough Street, so I guess I became a Beat by osmosis." —Charles Plymell

Charles Plymell is a poet, novelist, and small press publisher. Plymell has collaborated with and published many poets, writers, and artists, including principals of the Beat Generation. Benzedrine Highway, published in 2013, is an anthology of his best-known poetry and prose, including excerpts from his 1971 City Lights novel The Last of the Moccasins.

In this episode of Deviate, Charles and his wife Pamela Beach Plymell discuss their memories of (and interactions with) Jack Kerouac (4:55); Charley's upbringing in Dust Bowl-era Kansas, and his early road-trips to California (11:05); life as a young hood and hipster in Wichita (14:40); meeting and interacting with the Beats in San Francisco (19:20); rooming with Neal Cassady and Allen Ginsberg when Cassady was trying to write his own book (23:55); hosting Ginsberg during the poet's Wichita Vortex Sutra journey to Kansas in 1966 (30:50); publishing the first issue of R. Crumb's Zap Comix just before the Summer of Love (35:35); working at a teamster on the San Francisco docks, and getting his own novel published (39:50); and interacting with William S. Burroughs in the later years of the author's life (46:00).

For more information on Charley, check out his fan page at http://hipsterfansite.blogspot.com/.

Notable Links:

 	Beat Generation (literary movement)
 	Jack Kerouac (Beat author and poet)
 	William F. Buckley Jr. (conservative intellectual)
 	Firing Line (public affairs TV show)
 	Truman Capote (author and critic)
 	Hand on the Doorknob, by Charles Plymell (book)
 	Benzedrine and Dexedrine (amphetamine pills)
 	Neal Cassady (Beat Generation personality)
 	Allen Ginsberg (Beat poet)
 	The First Third, by Neal Cassady (book)
 	Lawrence Ferlinghetti (poet and publisher)
 	City Lights (independent bookstore)
 	Wichita Vortex Sutra, by Allen Ginsberg (poem)
 	"The Last Anti-War Poem," by Rolf Potts (essay)
 	Wichita Vortex (PBS documentary about the poem)
 	Robert Crumb (underground cartoonist)
 	Zap Comix (counterculture comic book series)
 	Summer of Love (1967 hippie event in San Francisco)
 	Human Be-in (Summer of Love even...]]>
                </itunes:summary>
                                                                            <itunes:duration>00:56:43</itunes:duration>
                                                    <itunes:author>
                    <![CDATA[Rolf Potts]]>
                </itunes:author>
                            </item>
                    <item>
                <title>
                    <![CDATA[Author Pam Houston on the joys of creating home amid a lifetime of travel]]>
                </title>
                <pubDate>Tue, 16 Oct 2018 00:01:24 +0000</pubDate>
                <dc:creator>Rolf Potts</dc:creator>
                <guid isPermaLink="true">
                    https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/podcasts/2160/episodes/-23315</guid>
                                    <link>https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/episodes/-23315</link>
                                <description>
                                            <![CDATA[<em>“How do we become who we are in the world? We ask the world to teach us.”</em> – Pam Houston

Pam Houston (<a href="https://twitter.com/pam_houston?lang=en">@pam_houston</a>) is an author and professor of English at the University of California, Davis. Her books include <a href="https://amzn.to/2RR5ihy">Cowboys Are My Weakness</a> and <a href="https://amzn.to/2RTj57p">Contents May Have Shifted</a>, with her latest, <a href="https://amzn.to/2RTjiaH">Deep Creek</a>, set for release in January 2019.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Pam discusses her interactions with writing students (2:30); living an non-traditional life (16:30); developing a notion of home (25:00); and how Pam’s life on the ranch affects her writing (34:00). The episode concludes with Rolf reading his short essay "<a href="https://rolfpotts.com/home-is-part-of-travel/">Creating a new sense of home is part of the travel process</a>."

For more information on Pam, check out her website at <a href="https://pamhouston.wordpress.com/">https://pamhouston.wordpress.com/</a>

<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://santafeworkshops.com/workshops/writers_lab/">Santa Fe Writers Workshop</a></li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://www.outsideonline.com/2237486/some-kind-calling">Some Kind of Calling</a>," by Pam Houston (essay)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.outsideonline.com/2322676/my-first-true-love">"Pam Houston on (Finally) Finding True Love</a>" (essay)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2NITevg">Desert Solitaire</a>, by Edward Abbey (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2EynMkr">Pilgrim at Tinker Creek</a>, by Annie Dillard (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2CfRuI6">My Antonia</a>, by Willa Cather (novel)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alice_Munro">Alice Munro</a> (author)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terry_Tempest_Williams">Terry Tempest Williams</a> (author)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2CKtBJA">The Meadow</a>, by James Galvan (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/West_Fork_Complex">West Fork Complex</a> (2013 wildfire)</li>
</ul>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                                    </description>
                <itunes:subtitle>
                    <![CDATA[“How do we become who we are in the world? We ask the world to teach us.” – Pam Houston

Pam Houston (@pam_houston) is an author and professor of English at the University of California, Davis. Her books include Cowboys Are My Weakness and Contents May Have Shifted, with her latest, Deep Creek, set for release in January 2019.

In this episode of Deviate, Pam discusses her interactions with writing students (2:30); living an non-traditional life (16:30); developing a notion of home (25:00); and how Pam’s life on the ranch affects her writing (34:00). The episode concludes with Rolf reading his short essay "Creating a new sense of home is part of the travel process."

For more information on Pam, check out her website at https://pamhouston.wordpress.com/

Notable Links:

 	Santa Fe Writers Workshop
 	"Some Kind of Calling," by Pam Houston (essay)
 	"Pam Houston on (Finally) Finding True Love" (essay)
 	Desert Solitaire, by Edward Abbey (book)
 	Pilgrim at Tinker Creek, by Annie Dillard (book)
 	My Antonia, by Willa Cather (novel)
 	Alice Munro (author)
 	Terry Tempest Williams (author)
 	The Meadow, by James Galvan (book)
 	West Fork Complex (2013 wildfire)

The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album Lumber.

Note: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </itunes:subtitle>
                                <itunes:title>
                    <![CDATA[Author Pam Houston on the joys of creating home amid a lifetime of travel]]>
                </itunes:title>
                                                <itunes:explicit>false</itunes:explicit>
                <content:encoded>
                    <![CDATA[<em>“How do we become who we are in the world? We ask the world to teach us.”</em> – Pam Houston

Pam Houston (<a href="https://twitter.com/pam_houston?lang=en">@pam_houston</a>) is an author and professor of English at the University of California, Davis. Her books include <a href="https://amzn.to/2RR5ihy">Cowboys Are My Weakness</a> and <a href="https://amzn.to/2RTj57p">Contents May Have Shifted</a>, with her latest, <a href="https://amzn.to/2RTjiaH">Deep Creek</a>, set for release in January 2019.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Pam discusses her interactions with writing students (2:30); living an non-traditional life (16:30); developing a notion of home (25:00); and how Pam’s life on the ranch affects her writing (34:00). The episode concludes with Rolf reading his short essay "<a href="https://rolfpotts.com/home-is-part-of-travel/">Creating a new sense of home is part of the travel process</a>."

For more information on Pam, check out her website at <a href="https://pamhouston.wordpress.com/">https://pamhouston.wordpress.com/</a>

<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://santafeworkshops.com/workshops/writers_lab/">Santa Fe Writers Workshop</a></li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://www.outsideonline.com/2237486/some-kind-calling">Some Kind of Calling</a>," by Pam Houston (essay)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.outsideonline.com/2322676/my-first-true-love">"Pam Houston on (Finally) Finding True Love</a>" (essay)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2NITevg">Desert Solitaire</a>, by Edward Abbey (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2EynMkr">Pilgrim at Tinker Creek</a>, by Annie Dillard (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2CfRuI6">My Antonia</a>, by Willa Cather (novel)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alice_Munro">Alice Munro</a> (author)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terry_Tempest_Williams">Terry Tempest Williams</a> (author)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2CKtBJA">The Meadow</a>, by James Galvan (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/West_Fork_Complex">West Fork Complex</a> (2013 wildfire)</li>
</ul>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </content:encoded>
                                    <enclosure url="https://episodes.castos.com/deviate/Deviate-050-Houston.mp3" length=""
                        type="audio/mpeg">
                    </enclosure>
                                <itunes:summary>
                    <![CDATA[“How do we become who we are in the world? We ask the world to teach us.” – Pam Houston

Pam Houston (@pam_houston) is an author and professor of English at the University of California, Davis. Her books include Cowboys Are My Weakness and Contents May Have Shifted, with her latest, Deep Creek, set for release in January 2019.

In this episode of Deviate, Pam discusses her interactions with writing students (2:30); living an non-traditional life (16:30); developing a notion of home (25:00); and how Pam’s life on the ranch affects her writing (34:00). The episode concludes with Rolf reading his short essay "Creating a new sense of home is part of the travel process."

For more information on Pam, check out her website at https://pamhouston.wordpress.com/

Notable Links:

 	Santa Fe Writers Workshop
 	"Some Kind of Calling," by Pam Houston (essay)
 	"Pam Houston on (Finally) Finding True Love" (essay)
 	Desert Solitaire, by Edward Abbey (book)
 	Pilgrim at Tinker Creek, by Annie Dillard (book)
 	My Antonia, by Willa Cather (novel)
 	Alice Munro (author)
 	Terry Tempest Williams (author)
 	The Meadow, by James Galvan (book)
 	West Fork Complex (2013 wildfire)

The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album Lumber.

Note: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </itunes:summary>
                                                                            <itunes:duration>00:46:56</itunes:duration>
                                                    <itunes:author>
                    <![CDATA[Rolf Potts]]>
                </itunes:author>
                            </item>
                    <item>
                <title>
                    <![CDATA[Major Jackson on the poetics of time (and how best, in life, to spend it)]]>
                </title>
                <pubDate>Tue, 02 Oct 2018 00:01:24 +0000</pubDate>
                <dc:creator>Rolf Potts</dc:creator>
                <guid isPermaLink="true">
                    https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/podcasts/2160/episodes/-22161</guid>
                                    <link>https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/episodes/-22161</link>
                                <description>
                                            <![CDATA[<em>“The act of creating is a way of stopping time.”</em> – Major Jackson

Major Jackson (<a href="https://twitter.com/Poet_Major?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor">@Poet_Major</a>) is an American poet, professor, and author of four collections of poetry: <em><a href="https://amzn.to/2OlNFYg">Roll Deep</a></em>, <em><a href="https://amzn.to/2xSxQPf">Holding Company</a>, <a href="https://amzn.to/2OlO0du">Hoops</a></em>, and <em><a href="https://www.amazon.com/Leaving-Saturn-Poems-Major-Jackson/dp/082032342X">Leaving Saturn</a></em>. He currently serves as the Poetry Editor of the <em>Harvard Review</em>.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and Major discuss the changing perception of time and how creation leads to a deeper experience of time (2:00); poetry and the lessons it teaches us about life (23:00); and time as prison, the way we claim our freedom, and art as a means toward transcendence (39:00).

For more information on Major, check out his website at <a href="http://www.majorjackson.com/">http://www.majorjackson.com/</a>

<u>Poems and books mentioned:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2IrIe4B">The Gutenberg Elegies</a></em>, by Sven Birkerts (book)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems/45564/the-world-is-too-much-with-us">The World Is Too Much With Us</a>" (poem by <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Wordsworth">William Wordsworth</a>)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/To_the_Virgins,_to_Make_Much_of_Time">To the Virgins, to Make Much of Time</a>" (poem by <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Herrick_(poet)">Robert Herrick</a>)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ode:_Intimations_of_Immortality">Ode: Intimations of Immortality</a>" (Wordsworth poem)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://www.poets.org/poetsorg/poem/disappearing">On Disappearing</a>" (poem by Major Jackson)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poetrymagazine/browse?contentId=38224">Stations</a>" (poem by Stanley Moss)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2IphjX8"><em>Into the Mecca</em></a> by Gwendolyn Brooks (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.poetryarchive.org/poem/jerusalem">Jerusalem</a> (poem by James Fenton)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poetrymagazine/articles/69420/jerusalem">Jerusalem</a>, by Peter Cole (essay)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2QhPbIb">The Snow Leopard</a></em>, by Peter Matthiessen (book)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lying_in_a_Hammock_at_William_Duffy%27s_Farm_in_Pine_Island,_Minnesota">Lying in a Hammock at William Duffy’s Farm in Pine Island, Minnesota</a>" (poem by James Wright)</li>
</ul>
<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="http://pariswritingworkshop.com/">Paris Writing Workshop</a> (summer creative writing course)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dead_Poets_Society">Dead Poets Society</a></em> (film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carpe_diem">Carpe Diem</a> (Latin aphorism)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walt_Whitman">Walt Whitman</a> (poet)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern_State_Penitentiary">Eastern State Penitentiary</a> (former prison in Philadelphia)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michel_Foucault">Michel Foucault</a> (philosopher)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/True_Detective">True Detective</a></em> (HBO TV series)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Muir">John Muir</a> (naturalist)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_Kerouac">Jack Kerouac</a> (author)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Croesus">Croesus</a> (wealthy king from ancient times)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seneca_the_Younger">Seneca</a> (philosopher)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dazed_and_Confused_(film)">Dazed and Confused</a></em> (film)</li>
 	<li></li></ul>]]>
                                    </description>
                <itunes:subtitle>
                    <![CDATA[“The act of creating is a way of stopping time.” – Major Jackson

Major Jackson (@Poet_Major) is an American poet, professor, and author of four collections of poetry: Roll Deep, Holding Company, Hoops, and Leaving Saturn. He currently serves as the Poetry Editor of the Harvard Review.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf and Major discuss the changing perception of time and how creation leads to a deeper experience of time (2:00); poetry and the lessons it teaches us about life (23:00); and time as prison, the way we claim our freedom, and art as a means toward transcendence (39:00).

For more information on Major, check out his website at http://www.majorjackson.com/

Poems and books mentioned:

 	The Gutenberg Elegies, by Sven Birkerts (book)
 	"The World Is Too Much With Us" (poem by William Wordsworth)
 	"To the Virgins, to Make Much of Time" (poem by Robert Herrick)
 	"Ode: Intimations of Immortality" (Wordsworth poem)
 	"On Disappearing" (poem by Major Jackson)
 	"Stations" (poem by Stanley Moss)
 	Into the Mecca by Gwendolyn Brooks (book)
 	Jerusalem (poem by James Fenton)
 	Jerusalem, by Peter Cole (essay)
 	The Snow Leopard, by Peter Matthiessen (book)
 	"Lying in a Hammock at William Duffy’s Farm in Pine Island, Minnesota" (poem by James Wright)

Notable Links:

 	Paris Writing Workshop (summer creative writing course)
 	Dead Poets Society (film)
 	Carpe Diem (Latin aphorism)
 	Walt Whitman (poet)
 	Eastern State Penitentiary (former prison in Philadelphia)
 	Michel Foucault (philosopher)
 	True Detective (HBO TV series)
 	John Muir (naturalist)
 	Jack Kerouac (author)
 	Croesus (wealthy king from ancient times)
 	Seneca (philosopher)
 	Dazed and Confused (film)
 	]]>
                </itunes:subtitle>
                                <itunes:title>
                    <![CDATA[Major Jackson on the poetics of time (and how best, in life, to spend it)]]>
                </itunes:title>
                                                <itunes:explicit>false</itunes:explicit>
                <content:encoded>
                    <![CDATA[<em>“The act of creating is a way of stopping time.”</em> – Major Jackson

Major Jackson (<a href="https://twitter.com/Poet_Major?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor">@Poet_Major</a>) is an American poet, professor, and author of four collections of poetry: <em><a href="https://amzn.to/2OlNFYg">Roll Deep</a></em>, <em><a href="https://amzn.to/2xSxQPf">Holding Company</a>, <a href="https://amzn.to/2OlO0du">Hoops</a></em>, and <em><a href="https://www.amazon.com/Leaving-Saturn-Poems-Major-Jackson/dp/082032342X">Leaving Saturn</a></em>. He currently serves as the Poetry Editor of the <em>Harvard Review</em>.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and Major discuss the changing perception of time and how creation leads to a deeper experience of time (2:00); poetry and the lessons it teaches us about life (23:00); and time as prison, the way we claim our freedom, and art as a means toward transcendence (39:00).

For more information on Major, check out his website at <a href="http://www.majorjackson.com/">http://www.majorjackson.com/</a>

<u>Poems and books mentioned:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2IrIe4B">The Gutenberg Elegies</a></em>, by Sven Birkerts (book)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems/45564/the-world-is-too-much-with-us">The World Is Too Much With Us</a>" (poem by <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Wordsworth">William Wordsworth</a>)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/To_the_Virgins,_to_Make_Much_of_Time">To the Virgins, to Make Much of Time</a>" (poem by <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Herrick_(poet)">Robert Herrick</a>)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ode:_Intimations_of_Immortality">Ode: Intimations of Immortality</a>" (Wordsworth poem)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://www.poets.org/poetsorg/poem/disappearing">On Disappearing</a>" (poem by Major Jackson)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poetrymagazine/browse?contentId=38224">Stations</a>" (poem by Stanley Moss)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2IphjX8"><em>Into the Mecca</em></a> by Gwendolyn Brooks (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.poetryarchive.org/poem/jerusalem">Jerusalem</a> (poem by James Fenton)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poetrymagazine/articles/69420/jerusalem">Jerusalem</a>, by Peter Cole (essay)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2QhPbIb">The Snow Leopard</a></em>, by Peter Matthiessen (book)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lying_in_a_Hammock_at_William_Duffy%27s_Farm_in_Pine_Island,_Minnesota">Lying in a Hammock at William Duffy’s Farm in Pine Island, Minnesota</a>" (poem by James Wright)</li>
</ul>
<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="http://pariswritingworkshop.com/">Paris Writing Workshop</a> (summer creative writing course)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dead_Poets_Society">Dead Poets Society</a></em> (film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carpe_diem">Carpe Diem</a> (Latin aphorism)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walt_Whitman">Walt Whitman</a> (poet)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern_State_Penitentiary">Eastern State Penitentiary</a> (former prison in Philadelphia)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michel_Foucault">Michel Foucault</a> (philosopher)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/True_Detective">True Detective</a></em> (HBO TV series)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Muir">John Muir</a> (naturalist)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_Kerouac">Jack Kerouac</a> (author)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Croesus">Croesus</a> (wealthy king from ancient times)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seneca_the_Younger">Seneca</a> (philosopher)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dazed_and_Confused_(film)">Dazed and Confused</a></em> (film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Linklater">Richard Linklater</a> (writer and director)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ingmar_Bergman">Ingmar Bergman</a> (director)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cin%C3%A9ma_v%C3%A9rit%C3%A9">Cinéma vérité</a> (documentary filmmaking style)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/rolfe-kent/">Film composer Rolfe Kent on Deviate</a> (podcast episode)</li>
</ul>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </content:encoded>
                                    <enclosure url="https://episodes.castos.com/deviate/Deviate-048-Jackson.mp3" length=""
                        type="audio/mpeg">
                    </enclosure>
                                <itunes:summary>
                    <![CDATA[“The act of creating is a way of stopping time.” – Major Jackson

Major Jackson (@Poet_Major) is an American poet, professor, and author of four collections of poetry: Roll Deep, Holding Company, Hoops, and Leaving Saturn. He currently serves as the Poetry Editor of the Harvard Review.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf and Major discuss the changing perception of time and how creation leads to a deeper experience of time (2:00); poetry and the lessons it teaches us about life (23:00); and time as prison, the way we claim our freedom, and art as a means toward transcendence (39:00).

For more information on Major, check out his website at http://www.majorjackson.com/

Poems and books mentioned:

 	The Gutenberg Elegies, by Sven Birkerts (book)
 	"The World Is Too Much With Us" (poem by William Wordsworth)
 	"To the Virgins, to Make Much of Time" (poem by Robert Herrick)
 	"Ode: Intimations of Immortality" (Wordsworth poem)
 	"On Disappearing" (poem by Major Jackson)
 	"Stations" (poem by Stanley Moss)
 	Into the Mecca by Gwendolyn Brooks (book)
 	Jerusalem (poem by James Fenton)
 	Jerusalem, by Peter Cole (essay)
 	The Snow Leopard, by Peter Matthiessen (book)
 	"Lying in a Hammock at William Duffy’s Farm in Pine Island, Minnesota" (poem by James Wright)

Notable Links:

 	Paris Writing Workshop (summer creative writing course)
 	Dead Poets Society (film)
 	Carpe Diem (Latin aphorism)
 	Walt Whitman (poet)
 	Eastern State Penitentiary (former prison in Philadelphia)
 	Michel Foucault (philosopher)
 	True Detective (HBO TV series)
 	John Muir (naturalist)
 	Jack Kerouac (author)
 	Croesus (wealthy king from ancient times)
 	Seneca (philosopher)
 	Dazed and Confused (film)
 	]]>
                </itunes:summary>
                                                                            <itunes:duration>00:58:23</itunes:duration>
                                                    <itunes:author>
                    <![CDATA[Rolf Potts]]>
                </itunes:author>
                            </item>
                    <item>
                <title>
                    <![CDATA[White Zombie guitarist J. Yuenger on music, expat life, and long-term travel]]>
                </title>
                <pubDate>Tue, 25 Sep 2018 00:01:07 +0000</pubDate>
                <dc:creator>Rolf Potts</dc:creator>
                <guid isPermaLink="true">
                    https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/podcasts/2160/episodes/-21328</guid>
                                    <link>https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/episodes/-21328</link>
                                <description>
                                            <![CDATA[<em>“</em><em>Travel feels like a generational signifier the way rock music was when I was a kid. The whole idea of having experiences as opposed to accumulating stuff feels like this planetary alignment, the way rock was in the '70s</em><em>.”</em> – Jay Yuenger

Jay Yuenger <a href="https://twitter.com/jyuenger?lang=en">(@JYuenger</a>) is a rock guitarist best known for his work with the Grammy-nominated heavy metal band <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Zombie_(band)">White Zombie</a>.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and Jay discuss Cuba and access to technology (3:00); J's White Zombie backstory, and his travels with the band (13:30); the rise in popularity of White Zombie and the evolution of travel (40:00); the breakup of the band and Jay’s post-band years spent traveling (50:00); and souvenirs (1:01:00)

For more information on Jay, check out his <a href="http://www.jyuenger.com/">website</a> or his <a href="https://www.instagram.com/jyuenger/">Instagram account</a>.

<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2QSdihN"><em>Vagabonding</em></a>, by Rolf Potts (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taxi_Driver">Taxi Driver</a> (film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yPNFVj-pISU">Thunder Kiss ’65</a> (song, by White Zombie)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anthony_Bourdain">Anthony Bourdain</a> (chef and travel documentarian)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2QUCPab">The Practical Nomad</a></em>, by Edward Hasbrouk (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hardcore_punk">Hardcore Punk</a> (music genre)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minor_Threat">Minor Threat</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metallica">Metallica</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Misfits_(band)">Misfits</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ramones">Ramones</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slayer">Slayer</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cro-Mags">Cro-Mags</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicidal_Tendencies">Suicidal Tendencies</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danzig_(band)">Danzig</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Headbangers_Ball">Headbangers Ball</a> (television program)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/120_Minutes">120 Minutes</a> (television program)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Butthole_Surfers">Butthole Surfers</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faith_No_More">Faith No More</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2I8C21f">Get in the Van</a>,</em> by Henry Rollins (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Smashing_Pumpkins">The Smashing Pumpkins</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/ian-mackaye/">Fugazi</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jane%27s_Addiction">Jane’s Addiction</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walt_Whitman">Walt Whitman</a> (poet)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurt_Vonnegut">Kurt Vonnegut</a> (author)</li>
</ul>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                                    </description>
                <itunes:subtitle>
                    <![CDATA[“Travel feels like a generational signifier the way rock music was when I was a kid. The whole idea of having experiences as opposed to accumulating stuff feels like this planetary alignment, the way rock was in the '70s.” – Jay Yuenger

Jay Yuenger (@JYuenger) is a rock guitarist best known for his work with the Grammy-nominated heavy metal band White Zombie.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf and Jay discuss Cuba and access to technology (3:00); J's White Zombie backstory, and his travels with the band (13:30); the rise in popularity of White Zombie and the evolution of travel (40:00); the breakup of the band and Jay’s post-band years spent traveling (50:00); and souvenirs (1:01:00)

For more information on Jay, check out his website or his Instagram account.

Notable Links:

 	Vagabonding, by Rolf Potts (book)
 	Taxi Driver (film)
 	Thunder Kiss ’65 (song, by White Zombie)
 	Anthony Bourdain (chef and travel documentarian)
 	The Practical Nomad, by Edward Hasbrouk (book)
 	Hardcore Punk (music genre)
 	Minor Threat (band)
 	Metallica (band)
 	Misfits (band)
 	Ramones (band)
 	Slayer (band)
 	Cro-Mags (band)
 	Suicidal Tendencies (band)
 	Danzig (band)
 	Headbangers Ball (television program)
 	120 Minutes (television program)
 	Butthole Surfers (band)
 	Faith No More (band)
 	Get in the Van, by Henry Rollins (book)
 	The Smashing Pumpkins (band)
 	Fugazi (band)
 	Jane’s Addiction (band)
 	Walt Whitman (poet)
 	Kurt Vonnegut (author)

The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album Lumber.

Note: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </itunes:subtitle>
                                <itunes:title>
                    <![CDATA[White Zombie guitarist J. Yuenger on music, expat life, and long-term travel]]>
                </itunes:title>
                                                <itunes:explicit>false</itunes:explicit>
                <content:encoded>
                    <![CDATA[<em>“</em><em>Travel feels like a generational signifier the way rock music was when I was a kid. The whole idea of having experiences as opposed to accumulating stuff feels like this planetary alignment, the way rock was in the '70s</em><em>.”</em> – Jay Yuenger

Jay Yuenger <a href="https://twitter.com/jyuenger?lang=en">(@JYuenger</a>) is a rock guitarist best known for his work with the Grammy-nominated heavy metal band <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Zombie_(band)">White Zombie</a>.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and Jay discuss Cuba and access to technology (3:00); J's White Zombie backstory, and his travels with the band (13:30); the rise in popularity of White Zombie and the evolution of travel (40:00); the breakup of the band and Jay’s post-band years spent traveling (50:00); and souvenirs (1:01:00)

For more information on Jay, check out his <a href="http://www.jyuenger.com/">website</a> or his <a href="https://www.instagram.com/jyuenger/">Instagram account</a>.

<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2QSdihN"><em>Vagabonding</em></a>, by Rolf Potts (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taxi_Driver">Taxi Driver</a> (film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yPNFVj-pISU">Thunder Kiss ’65</a> (song, by White Zombie)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anthony_Bourdain">Anthony Bourdain</a> (chef and travel documentarian)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2QUCPab">The Practical Nomad</a></em>, by Edward Hasbrouk (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hardcore_punk">Hardcore Punk</a> (music genre)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minor_Threat">Minor Threat</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metallica">Metallica</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Misfits_(band)">Misfits</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ramones">Ramones</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slayer">Slayer</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cro-Mags">Cro-Mags</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicidal_Tendencies">Suicidal Tendencies</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danzig_(band)">Danzig</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Headbangers_Ball">Headbangers Ball</a> (television program)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/120_Minutes">120 Minutes</a> (television program)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Butthole_Surfers">Butthole Surfers</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faith_No_More">Faith No More</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2I8C21f">Get in the Van</a>,</em> by Henry Rollins (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Smashing_Pumpkins">The Smashing Pumpkins</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/ian-mackaye/">Fugazi</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jane%27s_Addiction">Jane’s Addiction</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walt_Whitman">Walt Whitman</a> (poet)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurt_Vonnegut">Kurt Vonnegut</a> (author)</li>
</ul>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </content:encoded>
                                    <enclosure url="https://episodes.castos.com/deviate/Deviate-047-Yuenger.mp3" length=""
                        type="audio/mpeg">
                    </enclosure>
                                <itunes:summary>
                    <![CDATA[“Travel feels like a generational signifier the way rock music was when I was a kid. The whole idea of having experiences as opposed to accumulating stuff feels like this planetary alignment, the way rock was in the '70s.” – Jay Yuenger

Jay Yuenger (@JYuenger) is a rock guitarist best known for his work with the Grammy-nominated heavy metal band White Zombie.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf and Jay discuss Cuba and access to technology (3:00); J's White Zombie backstory, and his travels with the band (13:30); the rise in popularity of White Zombie and the evolution of travel (40:00); the breakup of the band and Jay’s post-band years spent traveling (50:00); and souvenirs (1:01:00)

For more information on Jay, check out his website or his Instagram account.

Notable Links:

 	Vagabonding, by Rolf Potts (book)
 	Taxi Driver (film)
 	Thunder Kiss ’65 (song, by White Zombie)
 	Anthony Bourdain (chef and travel documentarian)
 	The Practical Nomad, by Edward Hasbrouk (book)
 	Hardcore Punk (music genre)
 	Minor Threat (band)
 	Metallica (band)
 	Misfits (band)
 	Ramones (band)
 	Slayer (band)
 	Cro-Mags (band)
 	Suicidal Tendencies (band)
 	Danzig (band)
 	Headbangers Ball (television program)
 	120 Minutes (television program)
 	Butthole Surfers (band)
 	Faith No More (band)
 	Get in the Van, by Henry Rollins (book)
 	The Smashing Pumpkins (band)
 	Fugazi (band)
 	Jane’s Addiction (band)
 	Walt Whitman (poet)
 	Kurt Vonnegut (author)

The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album Lumber.

Note: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </itunes:summary>
                                                                            <itunes:duration>01:17:54</itunes:duration>
                                                    <itunes:author>
                    <![CDATA[Rolf Potts]]>
                </itunes:author>
                            </item>
                    <item>
                <title>
                    <![CDATA[Traveling Russia onboard the Trans-Siberian express: A 2018 case study]]>
                </title>
                <pubDate>Wed, 19 Sep 2018 00:01:12 +0000</pubDate>
                <dc:creator>Rolf Potts</dc:creator>
                <guid isPermaLink="true">
                    https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/podcasts/2160/episodes/-20922</guid>
                                    <link>https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/episodes/-20922</link>
                                <description>
                                            <![CDATA[<em>“I can’t imagine what the Trans-Siberian train would be like if you knew what time it was. That was the ongoing fun of the experience -- never really having any clue what time it was.”</em> – Jonathan Arlan

Jonathan Arlan (<a href="https://twitter.com/jonathanarlan?lang=en">@JonathanArlan</a>) is the author of the book <a href="https://amzn.to/2OtKEC5">Mountain Lines: A Journey through the French Alps</a> and a recent <em>Tablet </em>essay titled <a href="https://www.tabletmag.com/jewish-news-and-politics/266003/birobidzhan">Off the Rails in Birobidzhan</a>.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and Jonathan discuss travel bucket lists (2:30); the Trans-Siberian experience, including being an American on the train (12:30); the passing of time on the railway (28:00); and a final evaluation of the journey (38:00).

For more information on Jonathan Arlan, check out his website at <a href="http://jonathanarlan.com/">http://jonathanarlan.com/</a>

<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2Ou5q4v">Trans-Siberian Handbook</a>, by Bryn Thomas (guidebook)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2Or4yNX">Lonely Planet Trans-Siberian Railway</a> (guidebook)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://realrussia.co.uk/">Real Russia</a> (travel agency)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.monkeyshrine.com/">Monkeyshrine</a> (Trans-Siberian travel agency)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.seat61.com/">The Man in Seat 61</a> (train-travel website)</li>
</ul>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                                    </description>
                <itunes:subtitle>
                    <![CDATA[“I can’t imagine what the Trans-Siberian train would be like if you knew what time it was. That was the ongoing fun of the experience -- never really having any clue what time it was.” – Jonathan Arlan

Jonathan Arlan (@JonathanArlan) is the author of the book Mountain Lines: A Journey through the French Alps and a recent Tablet essay titled Off the Rails in Birobidzhan.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf and Jonathan discuss travel bucket lists (2:30); the Trans-Siberian experience, including being an American on the train (12:30); the passing of time on the railway (28:00); and a final evaluation of the journey (38:00).

For more information on Jonathan Arlan, check out his website at http://jonathanarlan.com/

Notable Links:

 	Trans-Siberian Handbook, by Bryn Thomas (guidebook)
 	Lonely Planet Trans-Siberian Railway (guidebook)
 	Real Russia (travel agency)
 	Monkeyshrine (Trans-Siberian travel agency)
 	The Man in Seat 61 (train-travel website)

The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album Lumber.

Note: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </itunes:subtitle>
                                <itunes:title>
                    <![CDATA[Traveling Russia onboard the Trans-Siberian express: A 2018 case study]]>
                </itunes:title>
                                                <itunes:explicit>false</itunes:explicit>
                <content:encoded>
                    <![CDATA[<em>“I can’t imagine what the Trans-Siberian train would be like if you knew what time it was. That was the ongoing fun of the experience -- never really having any clue what time it was.”</em> – Jonathan Arlan

Jonathan Arlan (<a href="https://twitter.com/jonathanarlan?lang=en">@JonathanArlan</a>) is the author of the book <a href="https://amzn.to/2OtKEC5">Mountain Lines: A Journey through the French Alps</a> and a recent <em>Tablet </em>essay titled <a href="https://www.tabletmag.com/jewish-news-and-politics/266003/birobidzhan">Off the Rails in Birobidzhan</a>.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and Jonathan discuss travel bucket lists (2:30); the Trans-Siberian experience, including being an American on the train (12:30); the passing of time on the railway (28:00); and a final evaluation of the journey (38:00).

For more information on Jonathan Arlan, check out his website at <a href="http://jonathanarlan.com/">http://jonathanarlan.com/</a>

<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2Ou5q4v">Trans-Siberian Handbook</a>, by Bryn Thomas (guidebook)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2Or4yNX">Lonely Planet Trans-Siberian Railway</a> (guidebook)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://realrussia.co.uk/">Real Russia</a> (travel agency)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.monkeyshrine.com/">Monkeyshrine</a> (Trans-Siberian travel agency)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.seat61.com/">The Man in Seat 61</a> (train-travel website)</li>
</ul>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </content:encoded>
                                    <enclosure url="https://episodes.castos.com/deviate/Deviate-046-Arian.mp3" length=""
                        type="audio/mpeg">
                    </enclosure>
                                <itunes:summary>
                    <![CDATA[“I can’t imagine what the Trans-Siberian train would be like if you knew what time it was. That was the ongoing fun of the experience -- never really having any clue what time it was.” – Jonathan Arlan

Jonathan Arlan (@JonathanArlan) is the author of the book Mountain Lines: A Journey through the French Alps and a recent Tablet essay titled Off the Rails in Birobidzhan.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf and Jonathan discuss travel bucket lists (2:30); the Trans-Siberian experience, including being an American on the train (12:30); the passing of time on the railway (28:00); and a final evaluation of the journey (38:00).

For more information on Jonathan Arlan, check out his website at http://jonathanarlan.com/

Notable Links:

 	Trans-Siberian Handbook, by Bryn Thomas (guidebook)
 	Lonely Planet Trans-Siberian Railway (guidebook)
 	Real Russia (travel agency)
 	Monkeyshrine (Trans-Siberian travel agency)
 	The Man in Seat 61 (train-travel website)

The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album Lumber.

Note: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </itunes:summary>
                                                                            <itunes:duration>00:42:10</itunes:duration>
                                                    <itunes:author>
                    <![CDATA[Rolf Potts]]>
                </itunes:author>
                            </item>
                    <item>
                <title>
                    <![CDATA[The great railway bizarre: A Trans-Siberian story (plus audio endnotes)]]>
                </title>
                <pubDate>Tue, 18 Sep 2018 00:01:18 +0000</pubDate>
                <dc:creator>Rolf Potts</dc:creator>
                <guid isPermaLink="true">
                    https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/podcasts/2160/episodes/-20923</guid>
                                    <link>https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/episodes/-20923</link>
                                <description>
                                            <![CDATA[<em>“If there is any revelation to be gleaned from spending several days on a single train, it will come from the bizarre details that lurk beneath the mundanity of the trip itself.”</em> – Rolf Potts

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf reads his essay <a href="https://rolfpotts.com/on-the-trans-siberian-express/">On the Trans-Siberian Express</a> (2:00) and then recounts, with Jonathan Arlan, the story behind the story, discussing his approach to writing about his experiences on the Trans-Siberian railroad (1:17:00).

Jonathan Arlan (<a href="https://twitter.com/jonathanarlan?lang=en">@JonathanArlan</a>) is the author of the book <a href="https://amzn.to/2QA8Zr7">Mountain Lines: A Journey through the French Alps</a> and a recent <em>Tablet </em>essay titled <a href="https://www.tabletmag.com/jewish-news-and-politics/266003/birobidzhan">Off the Rails in Birobidzhan</a>.

<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2QEkY7l">Marco Polo Didn’t Go There</a></em>, by Rolf Potts (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genghis_Khan">Genghis Khan</a> (historical figure)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Foster_Wallace">David Foster Wallace</a> (author)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2xk5Kew">In Xanadu</a></em>, by William Dalrymple (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naadam">Naadam</a> (festival)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ulan-Ude">Ulan-Ude</a> (Russian city)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Road_Scholar">Elderhostel</a>, i.e., Road Scholar (non-profit organization)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hunter_S._Thompson">Hunter S. Thompson</a> (journalist and author)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douglas_Coupland">Douglas Coupland</a> (author and artist)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fyodor_Dostoevsky">Fyodor Dostoevsky</a> (author)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_S._Burroughs">William S. Burroughs</a> (writer)</li>
</ul>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                                    </description>
                <itunes:subtitle>
                    <![CDATA[“If there is any revelation to be gleaned from spending several days on a single train, it will come from the bizarre details that lurk beneath the mundanity of the trip itself.” – Rolf Potts

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf reads his essay On the Trans-Siberian Express (2:00) and then recounts, with Jonathan Arlan, the story behind the story, discussing his approach to writing about his experiences on the Trans-Siberian railroad (1:17:00).

Jonathan Arlan (@JonathanArlan) is the author of the book Mountain Lines: A Journey through the French Alps and a recent Tablet essay titled Off the Rails in Birobidzhan.

Notable Links:

 	Marco Polo Didn’t Go There, by Rolf Potts (book)
 	Genghis Khan (historical figure)
 	David Foster Wallace (author)
 	In Xanadu, by William Dalrymple (book)
 	Naadam (festival)
 	Ulan-Ude (Russian city)
 	Elderhostel, i.e., Road Scholar (non-profit organization)
 	Hunter S. Thompson (journalist and author)
 	Douglas Coupland (author and artist)
 	Fyodor Dostoevsky (author)
 	William S. Burroughs (writer)

The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album Lumber.

Note: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </itunes:subtitle>
                                <itunes:title>
                    <![CDATA[The great railway bizarre: A Trans-Siberian story (plus audio endnotes)]]>
                </itunes:title>
                                                <itunes:explicit>false</itunes:explicit>
                <content:encoded>
                    <![CDATA[<em>“If there is any revelation to be gleaned from spending several days on a single train, it will come from the bizarre details that lurk beneath the mundanity of the trip itself.”</em> – Rolf Potts

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf reads his essay <a href="https://rolfpotts.com/on-the-trans-siberian-express/">On the Trans-Siberian Express</a> (2:00) and then recounts, with Jonathan Arlan, the story behind the story, discussing his approach to writing about his experiences on the Trans-Siberian railroad (1:17:00).

Jonathan Arlan (<a href="https://twitter.com/jonathanarlan?lang=en">@JonathanArlan</a>) is the author of the book <a href="https://amzn.to/2QA8Zr7">Mountain Lines: A Journey through the French Alps</a> and a recent <em>Tablet </em>essay titled <a href="https://www.tabletmag.com/jewish-news-and-politics/266003/birobidzhan">Off the Rails in Birobidzhan</a>.

<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2QEkY7l">Marco Polo Didn’t Go There</a></em>, by Rolf Potts (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genghis_Khan">Genghis Khan</a> (historical figure)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Foster_Wallace">David Foster Wallace</a> (author)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2xk5Kew">In Xanadu</a></em>, by William Dalrymple (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naadam">Naadam</a> (festival)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ulan-Ude">Ulan-Ude</a> (Russian city)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Road_Scholar">Elderhostel</a>, i.e., Road Scholar (non-profit organization)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hunter_S._Thompson">Hunter S. Thompson</a> (journalist and author)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douglas_Coupland">Douglas Coupland</a> (author and artist)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fyodor_Dostoevsky">Fyodor Dostoevsky</a> (author)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_S._Burroughs">William S. Burroughs</a> (writer)</li>
</ul>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </content:encoded>
                                    <enclosure url="https://episodes.castos.com/deviate/Deviate-045-TransSib.mp3" length=""
                        type="audio/mpeg">
                    </enclosure>
                                <itunes:summary>
                    <![CDATA[“If there is any revelation to be gleaned from spending several days on a single train, it will come from the bizarre details that lurk beneath the mundanity of the trip itself.” – Rolf Potts

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf reads his essay On the Trans-Siberian Express (2:00) and then recounts, with Jonathan Arlan, the story behind the story, discussing his approach to writing about his experiences on the Trans-Siberian railroad (1:17:00).

Jonathan Arlan (@JonathanArlan) is the author of the book Mountain Lines: A Journey through the French Alps and a recent Tablet essay titled Off the Rails in Birobidzhan.

Notable Links:

 	Marco Polo Didn’t Go There, by Rolf Potts (book)
 	Genghis Khan (historical figure)
 	David Foster Wallace (author)
 	In Xanadu, by William Dalrymple (book)
 	Naadam (festival)
 	Ulan-Ude (Russian city)
 	Elderhostel, i.e., Road Scholar (non-profit organization)
 	Hunter S. Thompson (journalist and author)
 	Douglas Coupland (author and artist)
 	Fyodor Dostoevsky (author)
 	William S. Burroughs (writer)

The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album Lumber.

Note: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </itunes:summary>
                                                                            <itunes:duration>01:35:35</itunes:duration>
                                                    <itunes:author>
                    <![CDATA[Rolf Potts]]>
                </itunes:author>
                            </item>
                    <item>
                <title>
                    <![CDATA[Writer-producer LaToya Morgan on TV storytelling and creative self-discipline]]>
                </title>
                <pubDate>Tue, 11 Sep 2018 00:01:15 +0000</pubDate>
                <dc:creator>Rolf Potts</dc:creator>
                <guid isPermaLink="true">
                    https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/podcasts/2160/episodes/-20424</guid>
                                    <link>https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/episodes/-20424</link>
                                <description>
                                            <![CDATA[<em>“It’s better for characters if their arc isn’t a straight line. You get to see how far they will go for something. You get to test them.”</em> – Latoya Morgan

LaToya Morgan (<a href="https://twitter.com/MorganicInk">@MorganicInk</a>) is screenwriter who currently serves an executive producer on AMC’s <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Into_the_Badlands_(TV_series)"><em>Into the Badlands</em></a>. Previously, she has worked on the shows <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shameless_(U.S._TV_series)"><em>Shameless</em></a> and <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turn:_Washington%27s_Spies"><em>Turn</em></a>. She is currently developing a drama for AMC based on Wesley Lowery’s best-selling book <a href="https://amzn.to/2O5FKec"><em>They Can’t Kill Us All</em></a>.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and LaToya talk about her early upbringing and influences (2:30); diversity on television (8:30); her decision to become a writer (15:00); the role of research versus personal experience in writing (28:00); the the experience of working in a writers' room (34:00); and managing work/life balance (48:00).

<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_King">Stephen King</a> (author)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Twilight_Zone">The Twilight Zone</a> (television show)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Mirror">Black Mirror</a> (television show)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Hospital">General Hospital</a> (television show)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_Life_to_Live">One Life to Live</a> (television show)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oprah_Winfrey">Oprah</a> (television personality / media executive)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friday_Night_Lights_(TV_series)">Friday Night Lights</a> (television show)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mad_Men">Mad Men</a> (television show)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Game_of_Thrones">Game of Thrones</a> (television show)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_X-Files">The X-Files</a> (television show)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Steinbeck">John Steinbeck</a> (author)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Film_Institute">American Film Institute</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlie_Chaplin">Charlie Chaplin</a> (actor)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/City_Lights">City Lights</a> (film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.finaldraft.com/">Final Draft</a> (screenwriting software)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melrose_Place">Melrose Place</a> (television show)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunset_Boulevard_(film)">Sunset Boulevard</a> (film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://televisionworkshop.warnerbros.com/writers-workshop/">Warner Brothers Television Writers’ Workshop</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southland_(TV_series)">Southland</a> (television show)</li>
</ul>
<span style="text-decoration:underline;">Books mentioned</span>:
<ul>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2oSMK34">Of Mice and Men</a></em>, by John Steinbeck</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2CLwUAW">The <em>Grapes</em> of Wrath</a>, by John Steinbeck</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2MmMz9K">Cannery Row</a></em>, by John Steinbeck</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2Qjo0xj">The Art of Dramatic Writing</a>,</em> by Lajos Egri</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2CEkAm9">Save the Cat</a></em>, by Blake Snyder</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2Qk4KQz">The Hero’s Journey</a></em>, by Joseph Campbell</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2MZ3Yu0"><em>Story</em></a>, by Robert McKee</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2CBkYSg"><em>On Writing</em></a>, by Stephen King</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2O4eqx1"><em>Outliers</em></a>, by Malcolm G...</li></ul>]]>
                                    </description>
                <itunes:subtitle>
                    <![CDATA[“It’s better for characters if their arc isn’t a straight line. You get to see how far they will go for something. You get to test them.” – Latoya Morgan

LaToya Morgan (@MorganicInk) is screenwriter who currently serves an executive producer on AMC’s Into the Badlands. Previously, she has worked on the shows Shameless and Turn. She is currently developing a drama for AMC based on Wesley Lowery’s best-selling book They Can’t Kill Us All.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf and LaToya talk about her early upbringing and influences (2:30); diversity on television (8:30); her decision to become a writer (15:00); the role of research versus personal experience in writing (28:00); the the experience of working in a writers' room (34:00); and managing work/life balance (48:00).

Notable Links:

 	Stephen King (author)
 	The Twilight Zone (television show)
 	Black Mirror (television show)
 	General Hospital (television show)
 	One Life to Live (television show)
 	Oprah (television personality / media executive)
 	Friday Night Lights (television show)
 	Mad Men (television show)
 	Game of Thrones (television show)
 	The X-Files (television show)
 	John Steinbeck (author)
 	American Film Institute
 	Charlie Chaplin (actor)
 	City Lights (film)
 	Final Draft (screenwriting software)
 	Melrose Place (television show)
 	Sunset Boulevard (film)
 	Warner Brothers Television Writers’ Workshop
 	Southland (television show)

Books mentioned:

 	Of Mice and Men, by John Steinbeck
 	The Grapes of Wrath, by John Steinbeck
 	Cannery Row, by John Steinbeck
 	The Art of Dramatic Writing, by Lajos Egri
 	Save the Cat, by Blake Snyder
 	The Hero’s Journey, by Joseph Campbell
 	Story, by Robert McKee
 	On Writing, by Stephen King
 	Outliers, by Malcolm G...]]>
                </itunes:subtitle>
                                <itunes:title>
                    <![CDATA[Writer-producer LaToya Morgan on TV storytelling and creative self-discipline]]>
                </itunes:title>
                                                <itunes:explicit>false</itunes:explicit>
                <content:encoded>
                    <![CDATA[<em>“It’s better for characters if their arc isn’t a straight line. You get to see how far they will go for something. You get to test them.”</em> – Latoya Morgan

LaToya Morgan (<a href="https://twitter.com/MorganicInk">@MorganicInk</a>) is screenwriter who currently serves an executive producer on AMC’s <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Into_the_Badlands_(TV_series)"><em>Into the Badlands</em></a>. Previously, she has worked on the shows <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shameless_(U.S._TV_series)"><em>Shameless</em></a> and <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turn:_Washington%27s_Spies"><em>Turn</em></a>. She is currently developing a drama for AMC based on Wesley Lowery’s best-selling book <a href="https://amzn.to/2O5FKec"><em>They Can’t Kill Us All</em></a>.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and LaToya talk about her early upbringing and influences (2:30); diversity on television (8:30); her decision to become a writer (15:00); the role of research versus personal experience in writing (28:00); the the experience of working in a writers' room (34:00); and managing work/life balance (48:00).

<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_King">Stephen King</a> (author)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Twilight_Zone">The Twilight Zone</a> (television show)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Mirror">Black Mirror</a> (television show)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Hospital">General Hospital</a> (television show)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_Life_to_Live">One Life to Live</a> (television show)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oprah_Winfrey">Oprah</a> (television personality / media executive)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friday_Night_Lights_(TV_series)">Friday Night Lights</a> (television show)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mad_Men">Mad Men</a> (television show)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Game_of_Thrones">Game of Thrones</a> (television show)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_X-Files">The X-Files</a> (television show)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Steinbeck">John Steinbeck</a> (author)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Film_Institute">American Film Institute</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlie_Chaplin">Charlie Chaplin</a> (actor)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/City_Lights">City Lights</a> (film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.finaldraft.com/">Final Draft</a> (screenwriting software)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melrose_Place">Melrose Place</a> (television show)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunset_Boulevard_(film)">Sunset Boulevard</a> (film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://televisionworkshop.warnerbros.com/writers-workshop/">Warner Brothers Television Writers’ Workshop</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southland_(TV_series)">Southland</a> (television show)</li>
</ul>
<span style="text-decoration:underline;">Books mentioned</span>:
<ul>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2oSMK34">Of Mice and Men</a></em>, by John Steinbeck</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2CLwUAW">The <em>Grapes</em> of Wrath</a>, by John Steinbeck</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2MmMz9K">Cannery Row</a></em>, by John Steinbeck</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2Qjo0xj">The Art of Dramatic Writing</a>,</em> by Lajos Egri</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2CEkAm9">Save the Cat</a></em>, by Blake Snyder</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2Qk4KQz">The Hero’s Journey</a></em>, by Joseph Campbell</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2MZ3Yu0"><em>Story</em></a>, by Robert McKee</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2CBkYSg"><em>On Writing</em></a>, by Stephen King</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2O4eqx1"><em>Outliers</em></a>, by Malcolm Gladwell</li>
</ul>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </content:encoded>
                                    <enclosure url="https://episodes.castos.com/deviate/Deviate-044-Morgan.mp3" length=""
                        type="audio/mpeg">
                    </enclosure>
                                <itunes:summary>
                    <![CDATA[“It’s better for characters if their arc isn’t a straight line. You get to see how far they will go for something. You get to test them.” – Latoya Morgan

LaToya Morgan (@MorganicInk) is screenwriter who currently serves an executive producer on AMC’s Into the Badlands. Previously, she has worked on the shows Shameless and Turn. She is currently developing a drama for AMC based on Wesley Lowery’s best-selling book They Can’t Kill Us All.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf and LaToya talk about her early upbringing and influences (2:30); diversity on television (8:30); her decision to become a writer (15:00); the role of research versus personal experience in writing (28:00); the the experience of working in a writers' room (34:00); and managing work/life balance (48:00).

Notable Links:

 	Stephen King (author)
 	The Twilight Zone (television show)
 	Black Mirror (television show)
 	General Hospital (television show)
 	One Life to Live (television show)
 	Oprah (television personality / media executive)
 	Friday Night Lights (television show)
 	Mad Men (television show)
 	Game of Thrones (television show)
 	The X-Files (television show)
 	John Steinbeck (author)
 	American Film Institute
 	Charlie Chaplin (actor)
 	City Lights (film)
 	Final Draft (screenwriting software)
 	Melrose Place (television show)
 	Sunset Boulevard (film)
 	Warner Brothers Television Writers’ Workshop
 	Southland (television show)

Books mentioned:

 	Of Mice and Men, by John Steinbeck
 	The Grapes of Wrath, by John Steinbeck
 	Cannery Row, by John Steinbeck
 	The Art of Dramatic Writing, by Lajos Egri
 	Save the Cat, by Blake Snyder
 	The Hero’s Journey, by Joseph Campbell
 	Story, by Robert McKee
 	On Writing, by Stephen King
 	Outliers, by Malcolm G...]]>
                </itunes:summary>
                                                                            <itunes:duration>00:56:35</itunes:duration>
                                                    <itunes:author>
                    <![CDATA[Rolf Potts]]>
                </itunes:author>
                            </item>
                    <item>
                <title>
                    <![CDATA[Punk icon Ian MacKaye on why we should question the official history of rock music]]>
                </title>
                <pubDate>Tue, 04 Sep 2018 00:01:08 +0000</pubDate>
                <dc:creator>Rolf Potts</dc:creator>
                <guid isPermaLink="true">
                    https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/podcasts/2160/episodes/-19872</guid>
                                    <link>https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/episodes/-19872</link>
                                <description>
                                            <![CDATA[<p class="p1"><em>“Punk is not a sound for me. It’s not a style of music. It’s not a look. It’s not even an attitude. For me punk is the free space: It’s the place where new ideas can be presented without having to hew to profit motives.”<span class="Apple-converted-space">  </span></em>— Ian MacKaye</p>
<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_MacKaye">Ian MacKaye</a> is the co-founder of <a href="https://www.dischord.com/">Dischord Records</a> and former front man for <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fugazi">Fugazi</a> and <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minor_Threat">Minor Threat</a>. He currently performs in the two-piece indie band <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Evens">The Evens</a> with his partner Amy Farina. He curates an informal archive of the Washington DC hardcore and post-hardcore music scenes, including the <a href="https://www.dischord.com/fugazi_live_series">Fugazi Live Series</a>, an extensive online library of digitized concert recordings.

In this episode of Deviate Rolf and Ian discuss the "Nirvana moment" of the early 1990s, how new ideas find their way into music, and how lesser known acts influence the dynamic of popular culture (8:00); the task of archiving and preserving evidence of music that was created outside the commercial music industry (29:00); skateboarding and punk rock as lenses through which to see the world in a different way (45:30); and the lessons and experiences of traveling the world as a musician.

<u>Notable links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2wBN7n2">Our Band Could Be Your Life</a></em>, by Michael Azerrad (2001 book)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2oB41xN">Lipstick Traces: A Secret History of the 20th Century</a></em>, by Greil Marcus (1989 book)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2Ne3sb4">Get in the Van: On the Road With Black Flag,</a></em> by Henry Rollins (1994 book)</li>
 	<li>“<a href="https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/lifestyle/style/1993/08/01/punk-lives-washingtons-fugazi-claims-its-just-a-band-so-why-do-so-many-kids-think-its-god/6c56fef5-780a-4a6e-8411-8c6b407e1eed/?utm_term=.a7c518b031ba">Why Do So Many Kids Think Fugazi is God?</a>” 1993 <em>Washington Post</em> article</li>
 	<li>Henry Rollins’ <a href="https://www.kcrw.com/music/shows/henry-rollins/kcrw-broadcast-ian-mackaye">2018 KCRW interview</a> with Ian MacKaye</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Woodstock_(film)">Woodstock</a></em> (documentary film)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Vietnam_War_(TV_series)">The Vietnam War</a></em> (Ken Burns TV documentary series)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Th%C3%ADch_Qu%E1%BA%A3ng_%C4%90%E1%BB%A9c">Thích Quảng Đức</a> (Vietnamese monk who died by self-immolation)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phonograph_cylinder">Phonograph cylinder</a> (19th century recording technology)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dada">Dada</a> (early 20th century avant-garde art movement)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rock_and_Roll_Hall_of_Fame">Rock &amp; Roll Hall of Fame</a> (museum)</li>
</ul>
<u>Bands, musicians, and music mentioned:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Rollins">Henry Rollins</a> (vocalist, author, and performer)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dave_Grohl">Dave Grohl</a> (rock musician)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurt_Cobain">Kurt Cobain</a> (rock musician)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ted_Nugent">Ted Nugent</a> (rock musician)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimi_Hendrix">Jimi Hendrix</a> (rock musician)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Stooges">The Stooges</a> (rock band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Flag_(band)">Black Flag</a> (hardcore punk band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bad_Brains">Bad Brains</a> (hardcore punk band)</li></ul>]]>
                                    </description>
                <itunes:subtitle>
                    <![CDATA[“Punk is not a sound for me. It’s not a style of music. It’s not a look. It’s not even an attitude. For me punk is the free space: It’s the place where new ideas can be presented without having to hew to profit motives.”  — Ian MacKaye
Ian MacKaye is the co-founder of Dischord Records and former front man for Fugazi and Minor Threat. He currently performs in the two-piece indie band The Evens with his partner Amy Farina. He curates an informal archive of the Washington DC hardcore and post-hardcore music scenes, including the Fugazi Live Series, an extensive online library of digitized concert recordings.

In this episode of Deviate Rolf and Ian discuss the "Nirvana moment" of the early 1990s, how new ideas find their way into music, and how lesser known acts influence the dynamic of popular culture (8:00); the task of archiving and preserving evidence of music that was created outside the commercial music industry (29:00); skateboarding and punk rock as lenses through which to see the world in a different way (45:30); and the lessons and experiences of traveling the world as a musician.

Notable links:

 	Our Band Could Be Your Life, by Michael Azerrad (2001 book)
 	Lipstick Traces: A Secret History of the 20th Century, by Greil Marcus (1989 book)
 	Get in the Van: On the Road With Black Flag, by Henry Rollins (1994 book)
 	“Why Do So Many Kids Think Fugazi is God?” 1993 Washington Post article
 	Henry Rollins’ 2018 KCRW interview with Ian MacKaye
 	Woodstock (documentary film)
 	The Vietnam War (Ken Burns TV documentary series)
 	Thích Quảng Đức (Vietnamese monk who died by self-immolation)
 	Phonograph cylinder (19th century recording technology)
 	Dada (early 20th century avant-garde art movement)
 	Rock & Roll Hall of Fame (museum)

Bands, musicians, and music mentioned:

 	Henry Rollins (vocalist, author, and performer)
 	Dave Grohl (rock musician)
 	Kurt Cobain (rock musician)
 	Ted Nugent (rock musician)
 	Jimi Hendrix (rock musician)
 	The Stooges (rock band)
 	Black Flag (hardcore punk band)
 	Bad Brains (hardcore punk band)]]>
                </itunes:subtitle>
                                <itunes:title>
                    <![CDATA[Punk icon Ian MacKaye on why we should question the official history of rock music]]>
                </itunes:title>
                                                <itunes:explicit>false</itunes:explicit>
                <content:encoded>
                    <![CDATA[<p class="p1"><em>“Punk is not a sound for me. It’s not a style of music. It’s not a look. It’s not even an attitude. For me punk is the free space: It’s the place where new ideas can be presented without having to hew to profit motives.”<span class="Apple-converted-space">  </span></em>— Ian MacKaye</p>
<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_MacKaye">Ian MacKaye</a> is the co-founder of <a href="https://www.dischord.com/">Dischord Records</a> and former front man for <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fugazi">Fugazi</a> and <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minor_Threat">Minor Threat</a>. He currently performs in the two-piece indie band <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Evens">The Evens</a> with his partner Amy Farina. He curates an informal archive of the Washington DC hardcore and post-hardcore music scenes, including the <a href="https://www.dischord.com/fugazi_live_series">Fugazi Live Series</a>, an extensive online library of digitized concert recordings.

In this episode of Deviate Rolf and Ian discuss the "Nirvana moment" of the early 1990s, how new ideas find their way into music, and how lesser known acts influence the dynamic of popular culture (8:00); the task of archiving and preserving evidence of music that was created outside the commercial music industry (29:00); skateboarding and punk rock as lenses through which to see the world in a different way (45:30); and the lessons and experiences of traveling the world as a musician.

<u>Notable links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2wBN7n2">Our Band Could Be Your Life</a></em>, by Michael Azerrad (2001 book)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2oB41xN">Lipstick Traces: A Secret History of the 20th Century</a></em>, by Greil Marcus (1989 book)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2Ne3sb4">Get in the Van: On the Road With Black Flag,</a></em> by Henry Rollins (1994 book)</li>
 	<li>“<a href="https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/lifestyle/style/1993/08/01/punk-lives-washingtons-fugazi-claims-its-just-a-band-so-why-do-so-many-kids-think-its-god/6c56fef5-780a-4a6e-8411-8c6b407e1eed/?utm_term=.a7c518b031ba">Why Do So Many Kids Think Fugazi is God?</a>” 1993 <em>Washington Post</em> article</li>
 	<li>Henry Rollins’ <a href="https://www.kcrw.com/music/shows/henry-rollins/kcrw-broadcast-ian-mackaye">2018 KCRW interview</a> with Ian MacKaye</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Woodstock_(film)">Woodstock</a></em> (documentary film)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Vietnam_War_(TV_series)">The Vietnam War</a></em> (Ken Burns TV documentary series)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Th%C3%ADch_Qu%E1%BA%A3ng_%C4%90%E1%BB%A9c">Thích Quảng Đức</a> (Vietnamese monk who died by self-immolation)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phonograph_cylinder">Phonograph cylinder</a> (19th century recording technology)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dada">Dada</a> (early 20th century avant-garde art movement)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rock_and_Roll_Hall_of_Fame">Rock &amp; Roll Hall of Fame</a> (museum)</li>
</ul>
<u>Bands, musicians, and music mentioned:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Rollins">Henry Rollins</a> (vocalist, author, and performer)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dave_Grohl">Dave Grohl</a> (rock musician)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurt_Cobain">Kurt Cobain</a> (rock musician)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ted_Nugent">Ted Nugent</a> (rock musician)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimi_Hendrix">Jimi Hendrix</a> (rock musician)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Stooges">The Stooges</a> (rock band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Flag_(band)">Black Flag</a> (hardcore punk band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bad_Brains">Bad Brains</a> (hardcore punk band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lungfish_(band)">Lungfish</a> (post-hardcore Dischord band from Baltimore)</li>
 	<li>Empire (post <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generation_X_(band)">Generation X</a> English punk band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dead_Moon">Dead Moon</a> (DIY garage punk band fronted by <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_Cole_(musician)">Fred Cole</a>)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heatmiser">Heatmiser</a> (early 1990s <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elliott_Smith">Elliott Smith</a> post-hardcore band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wipers">The Wipers</a> (1970s Portland punk band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greg_Ginn">Greg Ginn</a> and <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chuck_Dukowski">Chuck Dukowski</a> (Black Flag band members)</li>
 	<li>“The Laughing Song” (late 19th century recording by <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_W._Johnson_(singer)">George W. Johnson</a>)</li>
</ul>
 
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet">
<p dir="ltr" lang="en" xml:lang="en">Look what my hero Ian Mackaye (Minor Threat/Fugazi) just found: a letter I wrote to him when I was 14! Haha! <a href="http://t.co/Ak8gxZz5m6">pic.twitter.com/Ak8gxZz5m6</a></p>
— Foo Fighters (@foofighters) <a href="https://twitter.com/foofighters/status/603975634344255488?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">May 28, 2015</a></blockquote>


<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </content:encoded>
                                    <enclosure url="https://episodes.castos.com/deviate/Deviate-043-MacKaye.mp3" length=""
                        type="audio/mpeg">
                    </enclosure>
                                <itunes:summary>
                    <![CDATA[“Punk is not a sound for me. It’s not a style of music. It’s not a look. It’s not even an attitude. For me punk is the free space: It’s the place where new ideas can be presented without having to hew to profit motives.”  — Ian MacKaye
Ian MacKaye is the co-founder of Dischord Records and former front man for Fugazi and Minor Threat. He currently performs in the two-piece indie band The Evens with his partner Amy Farina. He curates an informal archive of the Washington DC hardcore and post-hardcore music scenes, including the Fugazi Live Series, an extensive online library of digitized concert recordings.

In this episode of Deviate Rolf and Ian discuss the "Nirvana moment" of the early 1990s, how new ideas find their way into music, and how lesser known acts influence the dynamic of popular culture (8:00); the task of archiving and preserving evidence of music that was created outside the commercial music industry (29:00); skateboarding and punk rock as lenses through which to see the world in a different way (45:30); and the lessons and experiences of traveling the world as a musician.

Notable links:

 	Our Band Could Be Your Life, by Michael Azerrad (2001 book)
 	Lipstick Traces: A Secret History of the 20th Century, by Greil Marcus (1989 book)
 	Get in the Van: On the Road With Black Flag, by Henry Rollins (1994 book)
 	“Why Do So Many Kids Think Fugazi is God?” 1993 Washington Post article
 	Henry Rollins’ 2018 KCRW interview with Ian MacKaye
 	Woodstock (documentary film)
 	The Vietnam War (Ken Burns TV documentary series)
 	Thích Quảng Đức (Vietnamese monk who died by self-immolation)
 	Phonograph cylinder (19th century recording technology)
 	Dada (early 20th century avant-garde art movement)
 	Rock & Roll Hall of Fame (museum)

Bands, musicians, and music mentioned:

 	Henry Rollins (vocalist, author, and performer)
 	Dave Grohl (rock musician)
 	Kurt Cobain (rock musician)
 	Ted Nugent (rock musician)
 	Jimi Hendrix (rock musician)
 	The Stooges (rock band)
 	Black Flag (hardcore punk band)
 	Bad Brains (hardcore punk band)]]>
                </itunes:summary>
                                                                            <itunes:duration>01:05:12</itunes:duration>
                                                    <itunes:author>
                    <![CDATA[Rolf Potts]]>
                </itunes:author>
                            </item>
                    <item>
                <title>
                    <![CDATA[How to survive a natural disaster (and recover when it's over)]]>
                </title>
                <pubDate>Tue, 21 Aug 2018 00:01:31 +0000</pubDate>
                <dc:creator>Rolf Potts</dc:creator>
                <guid isPermaLink="true">
                    https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/podcasts/2160/episodes/-18742</guid>
                                    <link>https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/episodes/-18742</link>
                                <description>
                                            <![CDATA[<em>"Social capital is as important as formal training when it comes to disaster response. We see in every event people who have never had emergency training playing critical roles."</em> – Daniel Neely

Daniel Neely is the Manager of Community Resilience and Regional Recovery Manager at the Wellington (New Zealand) Region Emergency Management Office.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and Daniel discuss the importance of community relationships when it comes to responding to a disaster (4:00); emergency preparedness tips (8:00); disaster response strategies (13:00); and preparing for a disaster from both a personal and business perspective (19:00).

For more disaster preparedness information, check out <a href="https://www.ready.gov/">https://www.ready.gov/</a> and <a href="https://getprepared.nz/">https://getprepared.nz/</a>

<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li>“<a href="https://www.expressnews.com/news/local/article/Quiet-teen-who-rescued-17-in-Harvey-flooding-wins-12762659.php">Teen who rescued 17 in Harvey flooding wins national Citizen Hero award</a>”</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.ready.gov/">Federal Emergency Preparedness Resources</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Emergency_Management_Agency">FEMA</a> (US Agency)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Flood_Insurance_Program">National Flood Insurance Program</a> (FEMA program)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.100resilientcities.org/">100 Resilient Cities</a> (Rockefeller program)</li>
 	<li>“<a href="https://www.ted.com/talks/caitria_and_morgan_o_neill_how_to_step_up_in_the_face_of_disaster">How to Step Up in the Face of Disaster</a>” (TED Talk)</li>
 	<li>“<a href="http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20150128-how-to-survive-a-disaster">How to survive a disaster</a>” (BBC article)</li>
 	<li>“<a href="https://theconversation.com/recovering-from-disasters-social-networks-matter-more-than-bottled-water-and-batteries-69611">Recovering from disasters</a>” (Conversation article)</li>
 	<li><a href="http://www.empowersf.org/">Neighborhood Empowerment Network</a> (community resilience alliance)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cajun_Navy">Cajun Navy</a> (volunteer group)</li>
 	<li><a href="http://www.research.lancs.ac.uk/portal/en/people/john-leach(a4208498-f75f-4d67-9163-badc810d931b).html">John Leach</a> (survival psychologist)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.lauriejohnsonconsulting.com/about">Laurie Johnson</a> (survival consultant)</li>
</ul>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                                    </description>
                <itunes:subtitle>
                    <![CDATA["Social capital is as important as formal training when it comes to disaster response. We see in every event people who have never had emergency training playing critical roles." – Daniel Neely

Daniel Neely is the Manager of Community Resilience and Regional Recovery Manager at the Wellington (New Zealand) Region Emergency Management Office.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf and Daniel discuss the importance of community relationships when it comes to responding to a disaster (4:00); emergency preparedness tips (8:00); disaster response strategies (13:00); and preparing for a disaster from both a personal and business perspective (19:00).

For more disaster preparedness information, check out https://www.ready.gov/ and https://getprepared.nz/

Notable Links:

 	“Teen who rescued 17 in Harvey flooding wins national Citizen Hero award”
 	Federal Emergency Preparedness Resources
 	FEMA (US Agency)
 	National Flood Insurance Program (FEMA program)
 	100 Resilient Cities (Rockefeller program)
 	“How to Step Up in the Face of Disaster” (TED Talk)
 	“How to survive a disaster” (BBC article)
 	“Recovering from disasters” (Conversation article)
 	Neighborhood Empowerment Network (community resilience alliance)
 	Cajun Navy (volunteer group)
 	John Leach (survival psychologist)
 	Laurie Johnson (survival consultant)

The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album Lumber.

Note: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </itunes:subtitle>
                                <itunes:title>
                    <![CDATA[How to survive a natural disaster (and recover when it's over)]]>
                </itunes:title>
                                                <itunes:explicit>false</itunes:explicit>
                <content:encoded>
                    <![CDATA[<em>"Social capital is as important as formal training when it comes to disaster response. We see in every event people who have never had emergency training playing critical roles."</em> – Daniel Neely

Daniel Neely is the Manager of Community Resilience and Regional Recovery Manager at the Wellington (New Zealand) Region Emergency Management Office.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and Daniel discuss the importance of community relationships when it comes to responding to a disaster (4:00); emergency preparedness tips (8:00); disaster response strategies (13:00); and preparing for a disaster from both a personal and business perspective (19:00).

For more disaster preparedness information, check out <a href="https://www.ready.gov/">https://www.ready.gov/</a> and <a href="https://getprepared.nz/">https://getprepared.nz/</a>

<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li>“<a href="https://www.expressnews.com/news/local/article/Quiet-teen-who-rescued-17-in-Harvey-flooding-wins-12762659.php">Teen who rescued 17 in Harvey flooding wins national Citizen Hero award</a>”</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.ready.gov/">Federal Emergency Preparedness Resources</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Emergency_Management_Agency">FEMA</a> (US Agency)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Flood_Insurance_Program">National Flood Insurance Program</a> (FEMA program)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.100resilientcities.org/">100 Resilient Cities</a> (Rockefeller program)</li>
 	<li>“<a href="https://www.ted.com/talks/caitria_and_morgan_o_neill_how_to_step_up_in_the_face_of_disaster">How to Step Up in the Face of Disaster</a>” (TED Talk)</li>
 	<li>“<a href="http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20150128-how-to-survive-a-disaster">How to survive a disaster</a>” (BBC article)</li>
 	<li>“<a href="https://theconversation.com/recovering-from-disasters-social-networks-matter-more-than-bottled-water-and-batteries-69611">Recovering from disasters</a>” (Conversation article)</li>
 	<li><a href="http://www.empowersf.org/">Neighborhood Empowerment Network</a> (community resilience alliance)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cajun_Navy">Cajun Navy</a> (volunteer group)</li>
 	<li><a href="http://www.research.lancs.ac.uk/portal/en/people/john-leach(a4208498-f75f-4d67-9163-badc810d931b).html">John Leach</a> (survival psychologist)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.lauriejohnsonconsulting.com/about">Laurie Johnson</a> (survival consultant)</li>
</ul>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </content:encoded>
                                    <enclosure url="https://episodes.castos.com/deviate/Deviate-042-Neely.mp3" length=""
                        type="audio/mpeg">
                    </enclosure>
                                <itunes:summary>
                    <![CDATA["Social capital is as important as formal training when it comes to disaster response. We see in every event people who have never had emergency training playing critical roles." – Daniel Neely

Daniel Neely is the Manager of Community Resilience and Regional Recovery Manager at the Wellington (New Zealand) Region Emergency Management Office.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf and Daniel discuss the importance of community relationships when it comes to responding to a disaster (4:00); emergency preparedness tips (8:00); disaster response strategies (13:00); and preparing for a disaster from both a personal and business perspective (19:00).

For more disaster preparedness information, check out https://www.ready.gov/ and https://getprepared.nz/

Notable Links:

 	“Teen who rescued 17 in Harvey flooding wins national Citizen Hero award”
 	Federal Emergency Preparedness Resources
 	FEMA (US Agency)
 	National Flood Insurance Program (FEMA program)
 	100 Resilient Cities (Rockefeller program)
 	“How to Step Up in the Face of Disaster” (TED Talk)
 	“How to survive a disaster” (BBC article)
 	“Recovering from disasters” (Conversation article)
 	Neighborhood Empowerment Network (community resilience alliance)
 	Cajun Navy (volunteer group)
 	John Leach (survival psychologist)
 	Laurie Johnson (survival consultant)

The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album Lumber.

Note: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </itunes:summary>
                                                                            <itunes:duration>00:43:16</itunes:duration>
                                                    <itunes:author>
                    <![CDATA[Rolf Potts]]>
                </itunes:author>
                            </item>
                    <item>
                <title>
                    <![CDATA[Wesley Morris on podcast-fame, sports, and performing blackness in America]]>
                </title>
                <pubDate>Tue, 14 Aug 2018 00:01:01 +0000</pubDate>
                <dc:creator>Rolf Potts</dc:creator>
                <guid isPermaLink="true">
                    https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/podcasts/2160/episodes/-18373</guid>
                                    <link>https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/episodes/-18373</link>
                                <description>
                                            <![CDATA[<em>“There’s nothing that will stop white people from trying to do some black shit. It’s fundamentally baked into every aspect of American popular culture. It is the first thing that we invented that was entirely ours </em>— <em>white people dressing as black people and entertaining other people.”</em> — Wesley Morris

Wesley Morris (<a href="https://twitter.com/wesley_morris">@Wesley_Morris</a>) the Pulitzer Prize-winning critic at large for the <em>New York Times</em>. Formerly the co-host of the <em>Grantland</em> podcast “<a href="http://grantland.com/tags/do-you-like-prince-movies/">Do You Like Prince Movies?</a>”, he now co-hosts the “<a href="https://www.nytimes.com/podcasts/still-processing">Still Processing</a>” podcast with <em>Times</em> colleague Jenna Wortham.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em> Rolf and Wesley discuss the nature of podcast celebrity and how it differs from traditional celebrity (2:45); the stories that sports uniforms tell to the people who watch sports (23:00); the unique task of cultural criticism in the 21st century (30:00); the challenge of being seen as racially representational as a journalist and critic (40:15); and Wesley’s upcoming book about the invention of the performance of blackness in America (51:00).

<u>Media personalities mentioned</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jenna_Wortham">Jenna Wortham</a> (technology reporter and podcaster)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roger_Ebert">Roger Ebert</a> (film critic)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ta-Nehisi_Coates">Ta-Nehisi Coates</a> (journalist and public intellectual)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Simmons">Bill Simmons</a> (sports columnist and podcaster)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ira_Glass">Ira Glass</a> (This American Life host)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angelo_Moore">Angelo Moore</a> (lead-singer of Fishbone)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lilly_Singh">Lilly Singh</a> (YouTube star)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rebecca_Black">Rebecca Black</a> (YouTube star)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emily_Bazelon">Emily Bazelon</a> (journalist and podcaster)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jordan_Peele">Jordan Peele</a> (film director and actor)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_MacKaye">Ian MacKaye</a> (DIY punk pioneer)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/rany-jazayerli/">Rany Jazayerli</a> (sports writer)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roxane_Gay">Roxane Gay</a> (writer and commentator)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spike_Lee">Spike Lee</a> (filmmaker)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sidney_Poitier">Sidney Poitier</a> (actor and diplomat)</li>
</ul>
<u>Books and articles mentioned</u>
<ul>
 	<li>“<a href="https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/01/magazine/the-misunderstood-genius-of-russell-westbrook.html">The Misunderstood Genius of Russell Westbrook</a>,” by Sam Anderson</li>
 	<li>“<a href="http://grantland.com/features/the-sportstorialist/">Bagginess, baseball bodies, and the post-steroid era</a>,” by Wesley Morris</li>
 	<li>“<a href="https://www.theatlantic.com/entertainment/archive/2013/11/-em-treme-em-s-big-problem-authenticity/281857/">Treme's Big Problem: Authenticity</a>,” by Rolf Potts</li>
 	<li>“<a href="http://grantland.com/features/the-frustrating-unlikeability-treme/">The Frustrating Unlikeability of Treme</a>,” by Alex Pappademas</li>
 	<li>“‘<a href="https://www.nytimes.com/2018/07/05/movies/whitney-review-whitney-houston-documentary.html">Whitney,’ a Pop Music Tragedy, Is Sad, Strange and Dismaying</a>,” By Wesley Morris</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2P6ieP1">The Geto Boys</a></em> (33 1/3), by Rolf Potts</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2P9JKeK">To the Break of Dawn</a></em>, by Jelani Cobb</li>
 	<li>“<a href="http..."></a></li></ul>]]>
                                    </description>
                <itunes:subtitle>
                    <![CDATA[“There’s nothing that will stop white people from trying to do some black shit. It’s fundamentally baked into every aspect of American popular culture. It is the first thing that we invented that was entirely ours — white people dressing as black people and entertaining other people.” — Wesley Morris

Wesley Morris (@Wesley_Morris) the Pulitzer Prize-winning critic at large for the New York Times. Formerly the co-host of the Grantland podcast “Do You Like Prince Movies?”, he now co-hosts the “Still Processing” podcast with Times colleague Jenna Wortham.

In this episode of Deviate Rolf and Wesley discuss the nature of podcast celebrity and how it differs from traditional celebrity (2:45); the stories that sports uniforms tell to the people who watch sports (23:00); the unique task of cultural criticism in the 21st century (30:00); the challenge of being seen as racially representational as a journalist and critic (40:15); and Wesley’s upcoming book about the invention of the performance of blackness in America (51:00).

Media personalities mentioned

 	Jenna Wortham (technology reporter and podcaster)
 	Roger Ebert (film critic)
 	Ta-Nehisi Coates (journalist and public intellectual)
 	Bill Simmons (sports columnist and podcaster)
 	Ira Glass (This American Life host)
 	Angelo Moore (lead-singer of Fishbone)
 	Lilly Singh (YouTube star)
 	Rebecca Black (YouTube star)
 	Emily Bazelon (journalist and podcaster)
 	Jordan Peele (film director and actor)
 	Ian MacKaye (DIY punk pioneer)
 	Rany Jazayerli (sports writer)
 	Roxane Gay (writer and commentator)
 	Spike Lee (filmmaker)
 	Sidney Poitier (actor and diplomat)

Books and articles mentioned

 	“The Misunderstood Genius of Russell Westbrook,” by Sam Anderson
 	“Bagginess, baseball bodies, and the post-steroid era,” by Wesley Morris
 	“Treme's Big Problem: Authenticity,” by Rolf Potts
 	“The Frustrating Unlikeability of Treme,” by Alex Pappademas
 	“‘Whitney,’ a Pop Music Tragedy, Is Sad, Strange and Dismaying,” By Wesley Morris
 	The Geto Boys (33 1/3), by Rolf Potts
 	To the Break of Dawn, by Jelani Cobb
 	“]]>
                </itunes:subtitle>
                                <itunes:title>
                    <![CDATA[Wesley Morris on podcast-fame, sports, and performing blackness in America]]>
                </itunes:title>
                                                <itunes:explicit>false</itunes:explicit>
                <content:encoded>
                    <![CDATA[<em>“There’s nothing that will stop white people from trying to do some black shit. It’s fundamentally baked into every aspect of American popular culture. It is the first thing that we invented that was entirely ours </em>— <em>white people dressing as black people and entertaining other people.”</em> — Wesley Morris

Wesley Morris (<a href="https://twitter.com/wesley_morris">@Wesley_Morris</a>) the Pulitzer Prize-winning critic at large for the <em>New York Times</em>. Formerly the co-host of the <em>Grantland</em> podcast “<a href="http://grantland.com/tags/do-you-like-prince-movies/">Do You Like Prince Movies?</a>”, he now co-hosts the “<a href="https://www.nytimes.com/podcasts/still-processing">Still Processing</a>” podcast with <em>Times</em> colleague Jenna Wortham.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em> Rolf and Wesley discuss the nature of podcast celebrity and how it differs from traditional celebrity (2:45); the stories that sports uniforms tell to the people who watch sports (23:00); the unique task of cultural criticism in the 21st century (30:00); the challenge of being seen as racially representational as a journalist and critic (40:15); and Wesley’s upcoming book about the invention of the performance of blackness in America (51:00).

<u>Media personalities mentioned</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jenna_Wortham">Jenna Wortham</a> (technology reporter and podcaster)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roger_Ebert">Roger Ebert</a> (film critic)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ta-Nehisi_Coates">Ta-Nehisi Coates</a> (journalist and public intellectual)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Simmons">Bill Simmons</a> (sports columnist and podcaster)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ira_Glass">Ira Glass</a> (This American Life host)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angelo_Moore">Angelo Moore</a> (lead-singer of Fishbone)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lilly_Singh">Lilly Singh</a> (YouTube star)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rebecca_Black">Rebecca Black</a> (YouTube star)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emily_Bazelon">Emily Bazelon</a> (journalist and podcaster)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jordan_Peele">Jordan Peele</a> (film director and actor)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_MacKaye">Ian MacKaye</a> (DIY punk pioneer)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/rany-jazayerli/">Rany Jazayerli</a> (sports writer)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roxane_Gay">Roxane Gay</a> (writer and commentator)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spike_Lee">Spike Lee</a> (filmmaker)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sidney_Poitier">Sidney Poitier</a> (actor and diplomat)</li>
</ul>
<u>Books and articles mentioned</u>
<ul>
 	<li>“<a href="https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/01/magazine/the-misunderstood-genius-of-russell-westbrook.html">The Misunderstood Genius of Russell Westbrook</a>,” by Sam Anderson</li>
 	<li>“<a href="http://grantland.com/features/the-sportstorialist/">Bagginess, baseball bodies, and the post-steroid era</a>,” by Wesley Morris</li>
 	<li>“<a href="https://www.theatlantic.com/entertainment/archive/2013/11/-em-treme-em-s-big-problem-authenticity/281857/">Treme's Big Problem: Authenticity</a>,” by Rolf Potts</li>
 	<li>“<a href="http://grantland.com/features/the-frustrating-unlikeability-treme/">The Frustrating Unlikeability of Treme</a>,” by Alex Pappademas</li>
 	<li>“‘<a href="https://www.nytimes.com/2018/07/05/movies/whitney-review-whitney-houston-documentary.html">Whitney,’ a Pop Music Tragedy, Is Sad, Strange and Dismaying</a>,” By Wesley Morris</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2P6ieP1">The Geto Boys</a></em> (33 1/3), by Rolf Potts</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2P9JKeK">To the Break of Dawn</a></em>, by Jelani Cobb</li>
 	<li>“<a href="http://revisionisthistory.com/episodes/26-the-hug-heard-round-the-world">The Hug Heard Round the World</a>,” (Malcolm Gladwell podcast episode)</li>
</ul>
<u>Other notable links</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="http://www.slate.com/articles/podcasts/gabfest.html">Slate Political Gabfest</a> (podcast)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://uni-watch.com/">UniWatch</a> (sports uniform website)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Real_tennis">Court tennis</a> (archaic sport)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ABA%E2%80%93NBA_merger">ABA/NBA merger</a> (basketball league realignment)</li>
 	<li><a href="http://www.espn.com/30for30/film?page=freespirits">Free Spirits</a> (30 for 30 episode about the ABA)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blaxploitation">Blaxploitation</a> (1970s film subgenre)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minstrel_show">Blackface minstrelsy</a> (American entertainment form)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Foster">Stephen Foster</a> (19th century songwriter)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post_Malone">Post Malone</a> (rapper)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chromeo">Chromeo</a> (electro-funk duo)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teena_Marie">Teena Marie</a> (singer-songwriter)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hall_%26_Oates">Hall &amp; Oates</a> (pop-music duo)</li>
</ul>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </content:encoded>
                                    <enclosure url="https://episodes.castos.com/deviate/Deviate-041-Morris.mp3" length=""
                        type="audio/mpeg">
                    </enclosure>
                                <itunes:summary>
                    <![CDATA[“There’s nothing that will stop white people from trying to do some black shit. It’s fundamentally baked into every aspect of American popular culture. It is the first thing that we invented that was entirely ours — white people dressing as black people and entertaining other people.” — Wesley Morris

Wesley Morris (@Wesley_Morris) the Pulitzer Prize-winning critic at large for the New York Times. Formerly the co-host of the Grantland podcast “Do You Like Prince Movies?”, he now co-hosts the “Still Processing” podcast with Times colleague Jenna Wortham.

In this episode of Deviate Rolf and Wesley discuss the nature of podcast celebrity and how it differs from traditional celebrity (2:45); the stories that sports uniforms tell to the people who watch sports (23:00); the unique task of cultural criticism in the 21st century (30:00); the challenge of being seen as racially representational as a journalist and critic (40:15); and Wesley’s upcoming book about the invention of the performance of blackness in America (51:00).

Media personalities mentioned

 	Jenna Wortham (technology reporter and podcaster)
 	Roger Ebert (film critic)
 	Ta-Nehisi Coates (journalist and public intellectual)
 	Bill Simmons (sports columnist and podcaster)
 	Ira Glass (This American Life host)
 	Angelo Moore (lead-singer of Fishbone)
 	Lilly Singh (YouTube star)
 	Rebecca Black (YouTube star)
 	Emily Bazelon (journalist and podcaster)
 	Jordan Peele (film director and actor)
 	Ian MacKaye (DIY punk pioneer)
 	Rany Jazayerli (sports writer)
 	Roxane Gay (writer and commentator)
 	Spike Lee (filmmaker)
 	Sidney Poitier (actor and diplomat)

Books and articles mentioned

 	“The Misunderstood Genius of Russell Westbrook,” by Sam Anderson
 	“Bagginess, baseball bodies, and the post-steroid era,” by Wesley Morris
 	“Treme's Big Problem: Authenticity,” by Rolf Potts
 	“The Frustrating Unlikeability of Treme,” by Alex Pappademas
 	“‘Whitney,’ a Pop Music Tragedy, Is Sad, Strange and Dismaying,” By Wesley Morris
 	The Geto Boys (33 1/3), by Rolf Potts
 	To the Break of Dawn, by Jelani Cobb
 	“]]>
                </itunes:summary>
                                                                            <itunes:duration>01:05:49</itunes:duration>
                                                    <itunes:author>
                    <![CDATA[Rolf Potts]]>
                </itunes:author>
                            </item>
                    <item>
                <title>
                    <![CDATA[Satanic backward masking changed 1980s rock (but not in the way you think)]]>
                </title>
                <pubDate>Tue, 07 Aug 2018 00:01:14 +0000</pubDate>
                <dc:creator>Rolf Potts</dc:creator>
                <guid isPermaLink="true">
                    https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/podcasts/2160/episodes/-17268</guid>
                                    <link>https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/episodes/-17268</link>
                                <description>
                                            <![CDATA[<p class="p1"><em>“There are the actual facts of what was happening in popular culture in the 1980s — and then there was this tantalizing notion that music played backwards was going to seed our minds with evil. Which was scary, but also kind of cool to a certain kid-like way of thinking. You can almost see a book like </em>Backward Masking Unmasked<em> as young-adult literature.”</em> — Rolf Potts</p>
In this episode of <em>Deviate</em> Rolf delves into another musical mystery — the idea of "backward masking" in rock music, and how it came to influence notions of "Satanic Panic" in America over the course of the 1980s. Returning to the show for this musical deep-dive are Jedd Beaudoin (<a href="https://twitter.com/JeddBeaudoin">@JeddBeaudoin</a>), who hosts the syndicated music show “<a href="http://kmuw.org/programs/strange-currency">Strange Currency</a>,” and Michael Carmody (<a href="https://www.instagram.com/carmody68/">@Carmody68)</a>, a <a href="http://kmuw.org/post/musical-life-michael-carmody">musician</a>, record collector, and <a href="http://www.wearewichita.com/the-donut-whole/">donut shop</a> entrepreneur.

Together they discuss preacher Jacob Aranza's underground-classic 1983 anti-rock book <a href="https://amzn.to/2vwyz6W"><em>Backward Masking Unmasked</em> </a>and its idiosyncratic take on popular music (4:00); the history of rock and roll and American culture that led up to Satanic Panic in the 1980s (31:10); how rock acts exploited the idea of Satanism to sell records just as preachers, politicians, and pop-journalists fixated on its supposed dangers to attract followers (42:10); and the legacy of Satanic Panic and the seeming lack of evil in today's popular music (1:05:45).

<u>Rock and roll curiosities mentioned</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Backmasking">Backmasking</a> (audio technique)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/tongue-in-check/">Gene Simmons’ Tongue</a> (Snopes article)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/blood-money/">Blood in KISS Comic Book</a> (Snopes article)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_is_dead">Paul is Dead</a> (Beatles urban legend)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aleister_Crowley">Aleister Crowley</a> (English occultist)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/robert-johnson-sold-his-soul-to-the-devil-in-rosedale-mississippi/">Robert Johnson sold soul to the devil</a> (blues myth)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sign_of_the_horns">Sign of the horns</a> (rock hand gesture)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eddie_(mascot)">Eddie</a> (zombie-like Iron Maiden mascot)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_Side_of_the_Rainbow">Dark Side of the Rainbow</a> (movie/album mashup)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acid_rock">Acid rock</a> (psychedelic rock subgenre)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Better_by_You,_Better_than_Me">Judas Priest suicide lawsuit</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_Solution">Ozzy Osbourne suicide lawsuit</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_Norwegian_black_metal_scene">Norwegian black metal</a> (extreme metal genre)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/classic-rock/">Classic rock is not dead. Classic rock is undead</a> (podcast episode)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2M8uMDz">Hammer of the Gods</a></em> (controversial book about Led Zeppelin)</li>
</ul>
<u>Movies and TV shows mentioned</u>
<ul>
 	<li>CHIPs “<a href="https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0534511/">Rock Devil Rock</a>” episode (1982)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Decline_of_Western_Civilization">The Decline of Western Civilization</a> (Penelope Spheeris documentary)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Decline_of_Western_Civilization_Part_II:_The_Metal_Years">Decline of Western Civilization Part II: The Metal Years&lt;...</a></li></ul>]]>
                                    </description>
                <itunes:subtitle>
                    <![CDATA[“There are the actual facts of what was happening in popular culture in the 1980s — and then there was this tantalizing notion that music played backwards was going to seed our minds with evil. Which was scary, but also kind of cool to a certain kid-like way of thinking. You can almost see a book like Backward Masking Unmasked as young-adult literature.” — Rolf Potts
In this episode of Deviate Rolf delves into another musical mystery — the idea of "backward masking" in rock music, and how it came to influence notions of "Satanic Panic" in America over the course of the 1980s. Returning to the show for this musical deep-dive are Jedd Beaudoin (@JeddBeaudoin), who hosts the syndicated music show “Strange Currency,” and Michael Carmody (@Carmody68), a musician, record collector, and donut shop entrepreneur.

Together they discuss preacher Jacob Aranza's underground-classic 1983 anti-rock book Backward Masking Unmasked and its idiosyncratic take on popular music (4:00); the history of rock and roll and American culture that led up to Satanic Panic in the 1980s (31:10); how rock acts exploited the idea of Satanism to sell records just as preachers, politicians, and pop-journalists fixated on its supposed dangers to attract followers (42:10); and the legacy of Satanic Panic and the seeming lack of evil in today's popular music (1:05:45).

Rock and roll curiosities mentioned

 	Backmasking (audio technique)
 	Gene Simmons’ Tongue (Snopes article)
 	Blood in KISS Comic Book (Snopes article)
 	Paul is Dead (Beatles urban legend)
 	Aleister Crowley (English occultist)
 	Robert Johnson sold soul to the devil (blues myth)
 	Sign of the horns (rock hand gesture)
 	Eddie (zombie-like Iron Maiden mascot)
 	Dark Side of the Rainbow (movie/album mashup)
 	Acid rock (psychedelic rock subgenre)
 	Judas Priest suicide lawsuit
 	Ozzy Osbourne suicide lawsuit
 	Norwegian black metal (extreme metal genre)
 	Classic rock is not dead. Classic rock is undead (podcast episode)
 	Hammer of the Gods (controversial book about Led Zeppelin)

Movies and TV shows mentioned

 	CHIPs “Rock Devil Rock” episode (1982)
 	The Decline of Western Civilization (Penelope Spheeris documentary)
 	Decline of Western Civilization Part II: The Metal Years<...]]>
                </itunes:subtitle>
                                <itunes:title>
                    <![CDATA[Satanic backward masking changed 1980s rock (but not in the way you think)]]>
                </itunes:title>
                                                <itunes:explicit>false</itunes:explicit>
                <content:encoded>
                    <![CDATA[<p class="p1"><em>“There are the actual facts of what was happening in popular culture in the 1980s — and then there was this tantalizing notion that music played backwards was going to seed our minds with evil. Which was scary, but also kind of cool to a certain kid-like way of thinking. You can almost see a book like </em>Backward Masking Unmasked<em> as young-adult literature.”</em> — Rolf Potts</p>
In this episode of <em>Deviate</em> Rolf delves into another musical mystery — the idea of "backward masking" in rock music, and how it came to influence notions of "Satanic Panic" in America over the course of the 1980s. Returning to the show for this musical deep-dive are Jedd Beaudoin (<a href="https://twitter.com/JeddBeaudoin">@JeddBeaudoin</a>), who hosts the syndicated music show “<a href="http://kmuw.org/programs/strange-currency">Strange Currency</a>,” and Michael Carmody (<a href="https://www.instagram.com/carmody68/">@Carmody68)</a>, a <a href="http://kmuw.org/post/musical-life-michael-carmody">musician</a>, record collector, and <a href="http://www.wearewichita.com/the-donut-whole/">donut shop</a> entrepreneur.

Together they discuss preacher Jacob Aranza's underground-classic 1983 anti-rock book <a href="https://amzn.to/2vwyz6W"><em>Backward Masking Unmasked</em> </a>and its idiosyncratic take on popular music (4:00); the history of rock and roll and American culture that led up to Satanic Panic in the 1980s (31:10); how rock acts exploited the idea of Satanism to sell records just as preachers, politicians, and pop-journalists fixated on its supposed dangers to attract followers (42:10); and the legacy of Satanic Panic and the seeming lack of evil in today's popular music (1:05:45).

<u>Rock and roll curiosities mentioned</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Backmasking">Backmasking</a> (audio technique)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/tongue-in-check/">Gene Simmons’ Tongue</a> (Snopes article)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/blood-money/">Blood in KISS Comic Book</a> (Snopes article)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_is_dead">Paul is Dead</a> (Beatles urban legend)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aleister_Crowley">Aleister Crowley</a> (English occultist)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/robert-johnson-sold-his-soul-to-the-devil-in-rosedale-mississippi/">Robert Johnson sold soul to the devil</a> (blues myth)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sign_of_the_horns">Sign of the horns</a> (rock hand gesture)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eddie_(mascot)">Eddie</a> (zombie-like Iron Maiden mascot)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_Side_of_the_Rainbow">Dark Side of the Rainbow</a> (movie/album mashup)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acid_rock">Acid rock</a> (psychedelic rock subgenre)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Better_by_You,_Better_than_Me">Judas Priest suicide lawsuit</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_Solution">Ozzy Osbourne suicide lawsuit</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_Norwegian_black_metal_scene">Norwegian black metal</a> (extreme metal genre)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/classic-rock/">Classic rock is not dead. Classic rock is undead</a> (podcast episode)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2M8uMDz">Hammer of the Gods</a></em> (controversial book about Led Zeppelin)</li>
</ul>
<u>Movies and TV shows mentioned</u>
<ul>
 	<li>CHIPs “<a href="https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0534511/">Rock Devil Rock</a>” episode (1982)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Decline_of_Western_Civilization">The Decline of Western Civilization</a> (Penelope Spheeris documentary)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Decline_of_Western_Civilization_Part_II:_The_Metal_Years">Decline of Western Civilization Part II: The Metal Years</a> (documentary)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosemary%27s_Baby_(film)">Rosemary’s Baby</a> (horror movie)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Exorcist_(film)">The Exorcist</a> (horror movie)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trick_or_Treat_(1986_film)">Trick or Treat</a> (horror movie)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manic_Pixie_Dream_Girl">Manic Pixie Dream Girl</a> (stock movie character)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0104140/">Dream Deceivers</a> (Judas Priest suicide trial documentary)</li>
</ul>
<u>Other people, institutions, and events mentioned</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satanic_ritual_abuse">Satanic Ritual Abuse</a> (moral panic)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Day-care_sex-abuse_hysteria">Day-care sex-abuse hysteria</a> (moral panic)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Vicary">James Vicary</a> (subliminal advertising researcher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_G._Watt">James Watt</a> (Interior secretary under Reagan)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tipper_Gore">Tipper Gore</a> (senator’s wife and anti-rock crusader)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Captain_%26_Tennille">Captain &amp; Tennille</a> (soft-rock artists)</li>
 	<li><a href="e">Bette Midler</a> (singer-songwriter)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Church_of_Satan">Church of Satan</a> (religious organization)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transcendental_Meditation">Transcendental Meditation</a> (spiritual practice)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dada">Dada</a> (avant-garde art movement)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.biblegateway.com/verse/en/1%20Samuel%2015%3A3">1 Samuel 15:3</a> (genocidal Bible verse)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/West_Memphis_Three">West Memphis Three</a> (wrongfully convicted ritual-murder suspects)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shout_at_the_Devil">Shout at the Devil</a> (Motley Crue album)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Columbine_High_School_massacre">Columbine High School massacre</a> (mass shooting)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/national-anthem/">The weird history of America’s national anthem</a> (podcast episode)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manson_Family">Manson murders</a> (cult killings)</li>
</ul>
<p style="text-align:center;"><span style="text-decoration:underline;"><strong>Rock Devil Rock <em>CHiPs</em> TV clip</strong></span></p>

<p style="text-align:center;"><span style="text-decoration:underline;"><strong><em>Quincy</em> punk-rock episode clip</strong></span></p>


<em>This episode was engineered by Torin Andersen of KMUW studios in Wichita. The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </content:encoded>
                                    <enclosure url="https://episodes.castos.com/deviate/Deviate-040-Beaudoin-Carmody.mp3" length=""
                        type="audio/mpeg">
                    </enclosure>
                                <itunes:summary>
                    <![CDATA[“There are the actual facts of what was happening in popular culture in the 1980s — and then there was this tantalizing notion that music played backwards was going to seed our minds with evil. Which was scary, but also kind of cool to a certain kid-like way of thinking. You can almost see a book like Backward Masking Unmasked as young-adult literature.” — Rolf Potts
In this episode of Deviate Rolf delves into another musical mystery — the idea of "backward masking" in rock music, and how it came to influence notions of "Satanic Panic" in America over the course of the 1980s. Returning to the show for this musical deep-dive are Jedd Beaudoin (@JeddBeaudoin), who hosts the syndicated music show “Strange Currency,” and Michael Carmody (@Carmody68), a musician, record collector, and donut shop entrepreneur.

Together they discuss preacher Jacob Aranza's underground-classic 1983 anti-rock book Backward Masking Unmasked and its idiosyncratic take on popular music (4:00); the history of rock and roll and American culture that led up to Satanic Panic in the 1980s (31:10); how rock acts exploited the idea of Satanism to sell records just as preachers, politicians, and pop-journalists fixated on its supposed dangers to attract followers (42:10); and the legacy of Satanic Panic and the seeming lack of evil in today's popular music (1:05:45).

Rock and roll curiosities mentioned

 	Backmasking (audio technique)
 	Gene Simmons’ Tongue (Snopes article)
 	Blood in KISS Comic Book (Snopes article)
 	Paul is Dead (Beatles urban legend)
 	Aleister Crowley (English occultist)
 	Robert Johnson sold soul to the devil (blues myth)
 	Sign of the horns (rock hand gesture)
 	Eddie (zombie-like Iron Maiden mascot)
 	Dark Side of the Rainbow (movie/album mashup)
 	Acid rock (psychedelic rock subgenre)
 	Judas Priest suicide lawsuit
 	Ozzy Osbourne suicide lawsuit
 	Norwegian black metal (extreme metal genre)
 	Classic rock is not dead. Classic rock is undead (podcast episode)
 	Hammer of the Gods (controversial book about Led Zeppelin)

Movies and TV shows mentioned

 	CHIPs “Rock Devil Rock” episode (1982)
 	The Decline of Western Civilization (Penelope Spheeris documentary)
 	Decline of Western Civilization Part II: The Metal Years<...]]>
                </itunes:summary>
                                                                            <itunes:duration>01:24:20</itunes:duration>
                                                    <itunes:author>
                    <![CDATA[Rolf Potts]]>
                </itunes:author>
                            </item>
                    <item>
                <title>
                    <![CDATA[Celebrating the best places to live (and the quest for home) in America]]>
                </title>
                <pubDate>Tue, 17 Jul 2018 00:01:17 +0000</pubDate>
                <dc:creator>Rolf Potts</dc:creator>
                <guid isPermaLink="true">
                    https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/podcasts/2160/episodes/-15925</guid>
                                    <link>https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/episodes/-15925</link>
                                <description>
                                            <![CDATA[<em>“We all have different priorities in life, and there is a place for each of us where we can live according to what those priorities are.”</em> – Winona Dimeo

Winona Dimeo (<a href="https://twitter.com/winona_rose?lang=en">@winona_rose</a>) is the managing editor of <a href="https://livability.com/">Livability.com</a>, a website that ranks America’s most livable small and mid-sized cities.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and Winona discuss what people are looking for in a place to live (2:00) and Livability.com’s latest rankings for America’s most livable cities (23:00). Then, Rolf takes recommendations from listeners on their favorite places to live in America (53:00).

For more livability tips, check out <a href="https://livability.com/best-places/top-100-best-places-to-live/2018">2018 Top 100 Best Places to Live</a>. Livability also publishes its <a href="https://livability.com/best-places/methodology">methodology</a>.

Cities mentioned in the main interview include: Portland, OR; Austin, TX; Minneapolis, MN; Pittsburgh, PA; Manhattan, KS; Lawrence, KS; Overland Park, KS; Lindsborg, KS; Ottawa, KS; Wichita, KS; Buffalo, NY; Rochester, MN; Kingsport, TN; Sevierville, TN; Fargo, ND; Savannah, GA; New Orleans, LA; Cincinnati, OH; Yellow Springs, OH; Athens, OH; Astoria, OR; Lincoln City, OR; Nashville, TN; Asheville, NC; Black Mountain, NC; Brevard, NC; Traverse City, MI; Marfa, TX; Charleston, SC; Bend, OR; and Hood River, OR.

<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="http://www.konza.ksu.edu/Splash/default.aspx">Konza Prairie</a> (biological preserve)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.nps.gov/tapr/index.htm">Tallgrass National Prairie Preserve</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kanopolis_State_Park">Kanopolis State Park</a></li>
 	<li><a href="http://www.stiefeltheatre.org/">Stiefel Theater</a></li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://www.thrillist.com/travel/nation/things-to-do-in-wichita-ks">One of the Coolest Cities in America Doesn't Even Realize It Yet</a>" (Thrillist article)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dollywood">Dollywood</a> (theme park)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://twitter.com/prairiestylfile">Alicia Underlee Nelson</a> (travel writer)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gooding_(band)">Gooding</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2us5F8f">1,000 Places to See Before You Die</a>, by Patricia Shultz (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oregon_Shakespeare_Festival">Oregon Shakespeare Festival</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transcendental_Meditation">Transcendental Meditation</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wallowa_Mountains">Wollowa Mountains</a> (mountain range)</li>
 	<li><a href="http://www.terminalgravitybrewing.com">Terminal Gravity</a> (brewery)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maharishi_Vastu_Architecture">Maharishi Vastu Architecture</a></li>
</ul>
<u>Audio contributors:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://twitter.com/adamkarlin">Adam Karlin</a> (Staunton, VA)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.aliciaard.com/">Alicia Ard</a> (Bend, OR)</li>
 	<li>Sarah Bell (Phoenixville, Pennsylvania)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.goodingmusic.com/">Gooding</a> (Kingston Springs, TN)</li>
 	<li><a href="http://cameraandflask.com/">Steven Gray</a> (Pensacola, FL)</li>
 	<li>Avery Gunns (Truth or Consequences, NM)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.gonomad.com/author/maxh">Max Hartshorne</a> (Northampton, MA)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.instagram.com/micheleherrmann/">Michele Hermann</a> (Buffalo, NY)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://karenhugg.com/">Karen Hugg</a> (Ashland, OR)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://twitter.com/jljosselyn">Jamie-Lee Josselyn</a> (Galena, IL)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.briankevin.com/">Brian Kevin</a> (Joseph, OR and Enterprise, OR)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://timleffel.com/">Tim Leffel</a> (Chattanooga, TN)</li>
 	<li><a href="http://www.bredeson.com/about">Debor...</a></li></ul>]]>
                                    </description>
                <itunes:subtitle>
                    <![CDATA[“We all have different priorities in life, and there is a place for each of us where we can live according to what those priorities are.” – Winona Dimeo

Winona Dimeo (@winona_rose) is the managing editor of Livability.com, a website that ranks America’s most livable small and mid-sized cities.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf and Winona discuss what people are looking for in a place to live (2:00) and Livability.com’s latest rankings for America’s most livable cities (23:00). Then, Rolf takes recommendations from listeners on their favorite places to live in America (53:00).

For more livability tips, check out 2018 Top 100 Best Places to Live. Livability also publishes its methodology.

Cities mentioned in the main interview include: Portland, OR; Austin, TX; Minneapolis, MN; Pittsburgh, PA; Manhattan, KS; Lawrence, KS; Overland Park, KS; Lindsborg, KS; Ottawa, KS; Wichita, KS; Buffalo, NY; Rochester, MN; Kingsport, TN; Sevierville, TN; Fargo, ND; Savannah, GA; New Orleans, LA; Cincinnati, OH; Yellow Springs, OH; Athens, OH; Astoria, OR; Lincoln City, OR; Nashville, TN; Asheville, NC; Black Mountain, NC; Brevard, NC; Traverse City, MI; Marfa, TX; Charleston, SC; Bend, OR; and Hood River, OR.

Notable Links:

 	Konza Prairie (biological preserve)
 	Tallgrass National Prairie Preserve
 	Kanopolis State Park
 	Stiefel Theater
 	"One of the Coolest Cities in America Doesn't Even Realize It Yet" (Thrillist article)
 	Dollywood (theme park)
 	Alicia Underlee Nelson (travel writer)
 	Gooding (band)
 	1,000 Places to See Before You Die, by Patricia Shultz (book)
 	Oregon Shakespeare Festival
 	Transcendental Meditation
 	Wollowa Mountains (mountain range)
 	Terminal Gravity (brewery)
 	Maharishi Vastu Architecture

Audio contributors:

 	Adam Karlin (Staunton, VA)
 	Alicia Ard (Bend, OR)
 	Sarah Bell (Phoenixville, Pennsylvania)
 	Gooding (Kingston Springs, TN)
 	Steven Gray (Pensacola, FL)
 	Avery Gunns (Truth or Consequences, NM)
 	Max Hartshorne (Northampton, MA)
 	Michele Hermann (Buffalo, NY)
 	Karen Hugg (Ashland, OR)
 	Jamie-Lee Josselyn (Galena, IL)
 	Brian Kevin (Joseph, OR and Enterprise, OR)
 	Tim Leffel (Chattanooga, TN)
 	Debor...]]>
                </itunes:subtitle>
                                <itunes:title>
                    <![CDATA[Celebrating the best places to live (and the quest for home) in America]]>
                </itunes:title>
                                                <itunes:explicit>false</itunes:explicit>
                <content:encoded>
                    <![CDATA[<em>“We all have different priorities in life, and there is a place for each of us where we can live according to what those priorities are.”</em> – Winona Dimeo

Winona Dimeo (<a href="https://twitter.com/winona_rose?lang=en">@winona_rose</a>) is the managing editor of <a href="https://livability.com/">Livability.com</a>, a website that ranks America’s most livable small and mid-sized cities.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and Winona discuss what people are looking for in a place to live (2:00) and Livability.com’s latest rankings for America’s most livable cities (23:00). Then, Rolf takes recommendations from listeners on their favorite places to live in America (53:00).

For more livability tips, check out <a href="https://livability.com/best-places/top-100-best-places-to-live/2018">2018 Top 100 Best Places to Live</a>. Livability also publishes its <a href="https://livability.com/best-places/methodology">methodology</a>.

Cities mentioned in the main interview include: Portland, OR; Austin, TX; Minneapolis, MN; Pittsburgh, PA; Manhattan, KS; Lawrence, KS; Overland Park, KS; Lindsborg, KS; Ottawa, KS; Wichita, KS; Buffalo, NY; Rochester, MN; Kingsport, TN; Sevierville, TN; Fargo, ND; Savannah, GA; New Orleans, LA; Cincinnati, OH; Yellow Springs, OH; Athens, OH; Astoria, OR; Lincoln City, OR; Nashville, TN; Asheville, NC; Black Mountain, NC; Brevard, NC; Traverse City, MI; Marfa, TX; Charleston, SC; Bend, OR; and Hood River, OR.

<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="http://www.konza.ksu.edu/Splash/default.aspx">Konza Prairie</a> (biological preserve)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.nps.gov/tapr/index.htm">Tallgrass National Prairie Preserve</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kanopolis_State_Park">Kanopolis State Park</a></li>
 	<li><a href="http://www.stiefeltheatre.org/">Stiefel Theater</a></li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://www.thrillist.com/travel/nation/things-to-do-in-wichita-ks">One of the Coolest Cities in America Doesn't Even Realize It Yet</a>" (Thrillist article)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dollywood">Dollywood</a> (theme park)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://twitter.com/prairiestylfile">Alicia Underlee Nelson</a> (travel writer)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gooding_(band)">Gooding</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2us5F8f">1,000 Places to See Before You Die</a>, by Patricia Shultz (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oregon_Shakespeare_Festival">Oregon Shakespeare Festival</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transcendental_Meditation">Transcendental Meditation</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wallowa_Mountains">Wollowa Mountains</a> (mountain range)</li>
 	<li><a href="http://www.terminalgravitybrewing.com">Terminal Gravity</a> (brewery)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maharishi_Vastu_Architecture">Maharishi Vastu Architecture</a></li>
</ul>
<u>Audio contributors:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://twitter.com/adamkarlin">Adam Karlin</a> (Staunton, VA)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.aliciaard.com/">Alicia Ard</a> (Bend, OR)</li>
 	<li>Sarah Bell (Phoenixville, Pennsylvania)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.goodingmusic.com/">Gooding</a> (Kingston Springs, TN)</li>
 	<li><a href="http://cameraandflask.com/">Steven Gray</a> (Pensacola, FL)</li>
 	<li>Avery Gunns (Truth or Consequences, NM)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.gonomad.com/author/maxh">Max Hartshorne</a> (Northampton, MA)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.instagram.com/micheleherrmann/">Michele Hermann</a> (Buffalo, NY)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://karenhugg.com/">Karen Hugg</a> (Ashland, OR)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://twitter.com/jljosselyn">Jamie-Lee Josselyn</a> (Galena, IL)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.briankevin.com/">Brian Kevin</a> (Joseph, OR and Enterprise, OR)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://timleffel.com/">Tim Leffel</a> (Chattanooga, TN)</li>
 	<li><a href="http://www.bredeson.com/about">Deborah Lewis</a> (Middlebury, VT)</li>
 	<li><a href="http://dintywmoore.com/">Dinty W. Moore</a> (Athens, OH)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://twitter.com/chrysser1">Chrystine Olson</a> (Graham, NC)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/patricia-schultz/">Patricia Schultz</a> (Beacon, NY)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.wanderingeducators.com/">Jessica Voigts</a> (Traverse City, MI)</li>
 	<li>Jason Wisdom (Fairfield, IA)</li>
</ul>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </content:encoded>
                                    <enclosure url="https://episodes.castos.com/deviate/Deviate-039-Karlin.mp3" length=""
                        type="audio/mpeg">
                    </enclosure>
                                <itunes:summary>
                    <![CDATA[“We all have different priorities in life, and there is a place for each of us where we can live according to what those priorities are.” – Winona Dimeo

Winona Dimeo (@winona_rose) is the managing editor of Livability.com, a website that ranks America’s most livable small and mid-sized cities.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf and Winona discuss what people are looking for in a place to live (2:00) and Livability.com’s latest rankings for America’s most livable cities (23:00). Then, Rolf takes recommendations from listeners on their favorite places to live in America (53:00).

For more livability tips, check out 2018 Top 100 Best Places to Live. Livability also publishes its methodology.

Cities mentioned in the main interview include: Portland, OR; Austin, TX; Minneapolis, MN; Pittsburgh, PA; Manhattan, KS; Lawrence, KS; Overland Park, KS; Lindsborg, KS; Ottawa, KS; Wichita, KS; Buffalo, NY; Rochester, MN; Kingsport, TN; Sevierville, TN; Fargo, ND; Savannah, GA; New Orleans, LA; Cincinnati, OH; Yellow Springs, OH; Athens, OH; Astoria, OR; Lincoln City, OR; Nashville, TN; Asheville, NC; Black Mountain, NC; Brevard, NC; Traverse City, MI; Marfa, TX; Charleston, SC; Bend, OR; and Hood River, OR.

Notable Links:

 	Konza Prairie (biological preserve)
 	Tallgrass National Prairie Preserve
 	Kanopolis State Park
 	Stiefel Theater
 	"One of the Coolest Cities in America Doesn't Even Realize It Yet" (Thrillist article)
 	Dollywood (theme park)
 	Alicia Underlee Nelson (travel writer)
 	Gooding (band)
 	1,000 Places to See Before You Die, by Patricia Shultz (book)
 	Oregon Shakespeare Festival
 	Transcendental Meditation
 	Wollowa Mountains (mountain range)
 	Terminal Gravity (brewery)
 	Maharishi Vastu Architecture

Audio contributors:

 	Adam Karlin (Staunton, VA)
 	Alicia Ard (Bend, OR)
 	Sarah Bell (Phoenixville, Pennsylvania)
 	Gooding (Kingston Springs, TN)
 	Steven Gray (Pensacola, FL)
 	Avery Gunns (Truth or Consequences, NM)
 	Max Hartshorne (Northampton, MA)
 	Michele Hermann (Buffalo, NY)
 	Karen Hugg (Ashland, OR)
 	Jamie-Lee Josselyn (Galena, IL)
 	Brian Kevin (Joseph, OR and Enterprise, OR)
 	Tim Leffel (Chattanooga, TN)
 	Debor...]]>
                </itunes:summary>
                                                                            <itunes:duration>01:16:31</itunes:duration>
                                                    <itunes:author>
                    <![CDATA[Rolf Potts]]>
                </itunes:author>
                            </item>
                    <item>
                <title>
                    <![CDATA[On American Highways II: A brief history of the Negro Motorist Green Book]]>
                </title>
                <pubDate>Wed, 11 Jul 2018 00:01:32 +0000</pubDate>
                <dc:creator>Rolf Potts</dc:creator>
                <guid isPermaLink="true">
                    https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/podcasts/2160/episodes/-15290</guid>
                                    <link>https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/episodes/-15290</link>
                                <description>
                                            <![CDATA[<em>“The traditional black experience is not the traditional white experience, so until we recognize that I don’t think it’s going change. But I think that is the first hurdle—compassion and consciousness.”</em> – Candacy Taylor

Candacy Taylor (<a href="https://twitter.com/candacytaylor?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor">@candacytaylor</a>) is a writer, photographer and cultural critic. She is the founder of <a href="http://taylormadeculture.com/">Taylor Made Culture</a>.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and Candacy discuss the African American experience along Route 66 (2:30); the history of <em>The Negro Motorist Green Book</em> (15:00); and the current travel issues facing African Americans (27:30).

<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Negro_Motorist_Green_Book">The Negro Motorist Green Book</a> (guidebook)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victor_Hugo_Green">Victor Hugo Green</a> (founder of <em>The Green Book</em>)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sundown_town">Sundown Town</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fantastic_Caverns">Fantastic Caverns</a> (show cave)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_A._Williams">John A. Williams</a> (author)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2KWPLc5">The Warmth of Other Suns</a>, by Isabel Wilkerson (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esso">Esso</a> (oil company)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harlem_riot_of_1935">Harlem Riot of 1935</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laura_Spelman_Rockefeller">Laura Spelman Rockefeller</a> (abolitionist and philanthropist)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sammy_Davis_Jr.">Sammy Davis Jr.</a> (musician)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duke_Ellington">Duke Ellington</a> (musician)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pearl_Bailey">Pearl Bailey</a> (actress and singer)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jackie_Robinson">Jackie Robinson</a> (baseball player)</li>
</ul>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                                    </description>
                <itunes:subtitle>
                    <![CDATA[“The traditional black experience is not the traditional white experience, so until we recognize that I don’t think it’s going change. But I think that is the first hurdle—compassion and consciousness.” – Candacy Taylor

Candacy Taylor (@candacytaylor) is a writer, photographer and cultural critic. She is the founder of Taylor Made Culture.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf and Candacy discuss the African American experience along Route 66 (2:30); the history of The Negro Motorist Green Book (15:00); and the current travel issues facing African Americans (27:30).

Notable Links:

 	The Negro Motorist Green Book (guidebook)
 	Victor Hugo Green (founder of The Green Book)
 	Sundown Town
 	Fantastic Caverns (show cave)
 	John A. Williams (author)
 	The Warmth of Other Suns, by Isabel Wilkerson (book)
 	Esso (oil company)
 	Harlem Riot of 1935
 	Laura Spelman Rockefeller (abolitionist and philanthropist)
 	Sammy Davis Jr. (musician)
 	Duke Ellington (musician)
 	Pearl Bailey (actress and singer)
 	Jackie Robinson (baseball player)

The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album Lumber.

Note: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </itunes:subtitle>
                                <itunes:title>
                    <![CDATA[On American Highways II: A brief history of the Negro Motorist Green Book]]>
                </itunes:title>
                                                <itunes:explicit>false</itunes:explicit>
                <content:encoded>
                    <![CDATA[<em>“The traditional black experience is not the traditional white experience, so until we recognize that I don’t think it’s going change. But I think that is the first hurdle—compassion and consciousness.”</em> – Candacy Taylor

Candacy Taylor (<a href="https://twitter.com/candacytaylor?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor">@candacytaylor</a>) is a writer, photographer and cultural critic. She is the founder of <a href="http://taylormadeculture.com/">Taylor Made Culture</a>.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and Candacy discuss the African American experience along Route 66 (2:30); the history of <em>The Negro Motorist Green Book</em> (15:00); and the current travel issues facing African Americans (27:30).

<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Negro_Motorist_Green_Book">The Negro Motorist Green Book</a> (guidebook)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victor_Hugo_Green">Victor Hugo Green</a> (founder of <em>The Green Book</em>)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sundown_town">Sundown Town</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fantastic_Caverns">Fantastic Caverns</a> (show cave)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_A._Williams">John A. Williams</a> (author)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2KWPLc5">The Warmth of Other Suns</a>, by Isabel Wilkerson (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esso">Esso</a> (oil company)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harlem_riot_of_1935">Harlem Riot of 1935</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laura_Spelman_Rockefeller">Laura Spelman Rockefeller</a> (abolitionist and philanthropist)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sammy_Davis_Jr.">Sammy Davis Jr.</a> (musician)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duke_Ellington">Duke Ellington</a> (musician)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pearl_Bailey">Pearl Bailey</a> (actress and singer)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jackie_Robinson">Jackie Robinson</a> (baseball player)</li>
</ul>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </content:encoded>
                                    <enclosure url="https://episodes.castos.com/deviate/Deviate-038-Taylor.mp3" length=""
                        type="audio/mpeg">
                    </enclosure>
                                <itunes:summary>
                    <![CDATA[“The traditional black experience is not the traditional white experience, so until we recognize that I don’t think it’s going change. But I think that is the first hurdle—compassion and consciousness.” – Candacy Taylor

Candacy Taylor (@candacytaylor) is a writer, photographer and cultural critic. She is the founder of Taylor Made Culture.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf and Candacy discuss the African American experience along Route 66 (2:30); the history of The Negro Motorist Green Book (15:00); and the current travel issues facing African Americans (27:30).

Notable Links:

 	The Negro Motorist Green Book (guidebook)
 	Victor Hugo Green (founder of The Green Book)
 	Sundown Town
 	Fantastic Caverns (show cave)
 	John A. Williams (author)
 	The Warmth of Other Suns, by Isabel Wilkerson (book)
 	Esso (oil company)
 	Harlem Riot of 1935
 	Laura Spelman Rockefeller (abolitionist and philanthropist)
 	Sammy Davis Jr. (musician)
 	Duke Ellington (musician)
 	Pearl Bailey (actress and singer)
 	Jackie Robinson (baseball player)

The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album Lumber.

Note: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </itunes:summary>
                                                                            <itunes:duration>00:33:28</itunes:duration>
                                                    <itunes:author>
                    <![CDATA[Rolf Potts]]>
                </itunes:author>
                            </item>
                    <item>
                <title>
                    <![CDATA[On American Highways I: A brief history of family road-trips in the USA]]>
                </title>
                <pubDate>Tue, 10 Jul 2018 00:01:48 +0000</pubDate>
                <dc:creator>Rolf Potts</dc:creator>
                <guid isPermaLink="true">
                    https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/podcasts/2160/episodes/-15293</guid>
                                    <link>https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/episodes/-15293</link>
                                <description>
                                            <![CDATA[<em>“Once again road trips are becoming more about the journey rather than the destination and I see that as a very encouraging sign that maybe people are realizing the merit of enjoying the journey.”</em> – Richard Ratay

Richard Ratay (<a href="https://twitter.com/richratay?lang=en">@RichRatay</a>) is the author of <em><a href="https://amzn.to/2u4Yra0">Don’t Make Me Pull Over!</a>,</em> an informal history of the family road trip.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and Richard discuss the history of long-haul automobile travel and the interstate highway system (6:00); the effects of interstate highways on American travel culture (19:00); the station wagon and the evolution of the road trip car (35:00); and the decline of the road trip Golden Age (48:00).

<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Ford">Henry Ford</a> (founder of Ford Motor Company)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horatio_Nelson_Jackson">Horatio Nelson Jackson</a> (automobile pioneer)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2J5NzNu">Desert Solitaire</a>, by Edward Abbey (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Howard_Deering_Johnson">Howard Deering Johnson</a> (entrepreneur and businessman)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motel_6">Motel 6</a> (hotel chain)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ralph_Teetor">Ralph Teeter</a> (inventor of cruise control)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_Can%27t_Drive_55">I Can’t Drive 55</a> (song by Sammy Hagar)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizens_band_radio">Citizens Band Radio</a> (short distance radio communications)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Convoy_(song)">Convoy</a> (song)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Convoy_(1978_film)">Convoy</a> (movie)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wooly_Willy">Wooly Willy</a> (toy)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Handheld_electronic_game">Handheld electronic games</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mattel">Mattel</a> (toy manufacturing company)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/sears-christmas-wish-book/">The Sears Christmas Wish Book was (truly) great American literature</a> (<em>Deviate</em> podcast episode)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/8-track_tape">8-track tape</a> (sound recording technology)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Lear">Bill Lear</a> (inventor and businessman)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barry_Manilow">Barry Manilow</a> (musician)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M*A*S*H_(TV_series)">M*A*S*H</a> (TV series)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MacArthur_Park_(song)">MacArthur Park</a> (song)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duran_Duran">Duran Duran</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herb_Kelleher">Herb Kelleher</a> (founder of Southwest Airlines)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Airline_Deregulation_Act">Airline Deregulation Act</a></li>
</ul>
<center></center>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                                    </description>
                <itunes:subtitle>
                    <![CDATA[“Once again road trips are becoming more about the journey rather than the destination and I see that as a very encouraging sign that maybe people are realizing the merit of enjoying the journey.” – Richard Ratay

Richard Ratay (@RichRatay) is the author of Don’t Make Me Pull Over!, an informal history of the family road trip.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf and Richard discuss the history of long-haul automobile travel and the interstate highway system (6:00); the effects of interstate highways on American travel culture (19:00); the station wagon and the evolution of the road trip car (35:00); and the decline of the road trip Golden Age (48:00).

Notable Links:

 	Henry Ford (founder of Ford Motor Company)
 	Horatio Nelson Jackson (automobile pioneer)
 	Desert Solitaire, by Edward Abbey (book)
 	Howard Deering Johnson (entrepreneur and businessman)
 	Motel 6 (hotel chain)
 	Ralph Teeter (inventor of cruise control)
 	I Can’t Drive 55 (song by Sammy Hagar)
 	Citizens Band Radio (short distance radio communications)
 	Convoy (song)
 	Convoy (movie)
 	Wooly Willy (toy)
 	Handheld electronic games
 	Mattel (toy manufacturing company)
 	The Sears Christmas Wish Book was (truly) great American literature (Deviate podcast episode)
 	8-track tape (sound recording technology)
 	Bill Lear (inventor and businessman)
 	Barry Manilow (musician)
 	M*A*S*H (TV series)
 	MacArthur Park (song)
 	Duran Duran (band)
 	Herb Kelleher (founder of Southwest Airlines)
 	Airline Deregulation Act


The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album Lumber.

Note: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </itunes:subtitle>
                                <itunes:title>
                    <![CDATA[On American Highways I: A brief history of family road-trips in the USA]]>
                </itunes:title>
                                                <itunes:explicit>false</itunes:explicit>
                <content:encoded>
                    <![CDATA[<em>“Once again road trips are becoming more about the journey rather than the destination and I see that as a very encouraging sign that maybe people are realizing the merit of enjoying the journey.”</em> – Richard Ratay

Richard Ratay (<a href="https://twitter.com/richratay?lang=en">@RichRatay</a>) is the author of <em><a href="https://amzn.to/2u4Yra0">Don’t Make Me Pull Over!</a>,</em> an informal history of the family road trip.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and Richard discuss the history of long-haul automobile travel and the interstate highway system (6:00); the effects of interstate highways on American travel culture (19:00); the station wagon and the evolution of the road trip car (35:00); and the decline of the road trip Golden Age (48:00).

<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Ford">Henry Ford</a> (founder of Ford Motor Company)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horatio_Nelson_Jackson">Horatio Nelson Jackson</a> (automobile pioneer)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2J5NzNu">Desert Solitaire</a>, by Edward Abbey (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Howard_Deering_Johnson">Howard Deering Johnson</a> (entrepreneur and businessman)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motel_6">Motel 6</a> (hotel chain)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ralph_Teetor">Ralph Teeter</a> (inventor of cruise control)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_Can%27t_Drive_55">I Can’t Drive 55</a> (song by Sammy Hagar)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizens_band_radio">Citizens Band Radio</a> (short distance radio communications)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Convoy_(song)">Convoy</a> (song)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Convoy_(1978_film)">Convoy</a> (movie)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wooly_Willy">Wooly Willy</a> (toy)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Handheld_electronic_game">Handheld electronic games</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mattel">Mattel</a> (toy manufacturing company)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/sears-christmas-wish-book/">The Sears Christmas Wish Book was (truly) great American literature</a> (<em>Deviate</em> podcast episode)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/8-track_tape">8-track tape</a> (sound recording technology)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Lear">Bill Lear</a> (inventor and businessman)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barry_Manilow">Barry Manilow</a> (musician)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M*A*S*H_(TV_series)">M*A*S*H</a> (TV series)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MacArthur_Park_(song)">MacArthur Park</a> (song)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duran_Duran">Duran Duran</a> (band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herb_Kelleher">Herb Kelleher</a> (founder of Southwest Airlines)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Airline_Deregulation_Act">Airline Deregulation Act</a></li>
</ul>
<center></center>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </content:encoded>
                                    <enclosure url="https://episodes.castos.com/deviate/Deviate-037-Ratay.mp3" length=""
                        type="audio/mpeg">
                    </enclosure>
                                <itunes:summary>
                    <![CDATA[“Once again road trips are becoming more about the journey rather than the destination and I see that as a very encouraging sign that maybe people are realizing the merit of enjoying the journey.” – Richard Ratay

Richard Ratay (@RichRatay) is the author of Don’t Make Me Pull Over!, an informal history of the family road trip.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf and Richard discuss the history of long-haul automobile travel and the interstate highway system (6:00); the effects of interstate highways on American travel culture (19:00); the station wagon and the evolution of the road trip car (35:00); and the decline of the road trip Golden Age (48:00).

Notable Links:

 	Henry Ford (founder of Ford Motor Company)
 	Horatio Nelson Jackson (automobile pioneer)
 	Desert Solitaire, by Edward Abbey (book)
 	Howard Deering Johnson (entrepreneur and businessman)
 	Motel 6 (hotel chain)
 	Ralph Teeter (inventor of cruise control)
 	I Can’t Drive 55 (song by Sammy Hagar)
 	Citizens Band Radio (short distance radio communications)
 	Convoy (song)
 	Convoy (movie)
 	Wooly Willy (toy)
 	Handheld electronic games
 	Mattel (toy manufacturing company)
 	The Sears Christmas Wish Book was (truly) great American literature (Deviate podcast episode)
 	8-track tape (sound recording technology)
 	Bill Lear (inventor and businessman)
 	Barry Manilow (musician)
 	M*A*S*H (TV series)
 	MacArthur Park (song)
 	Duran Duran (band)
 	Herb Kelleher (founder of Southwest Airlines)
 	Airline Deregulation Act


The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album Lumber.

Note: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </itunes:summary>
                                                                            <itunes:duration>00:57:23</itunes:duration>
                                                    <itunes:author>
                    <![CDATA[Rolf Potts]]>
                </itunes:author>
                            </item>
                    <item>
                <title>
                    <![CDATA[How to break up with your smartphone (and rediscover your real-world life)]]>
                </title>
                <pubDate>Tue, 03 Jul 2018 00:01:14 +0000</pubDate>
                <dc:creator>Rolf Potts</dc:creator>
                <guid isPermaLink="true">
                    https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/podcasts/2160/episodes/-14521</guid>
                                    <link>https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/episodes/-14521</link>
                                <description>
                                            <![CDATA[<em> “Travel should not be a checklist; it should be about having new experiences”</em> – Catherine Price

Catherine Price (<a href="https://twitter.com/catherine_price?lang=en">@Catherine_Price</a>) is a journalist and author of <a href="https://amzn.to/2tNJ4Tj">How to Break Up with Your Phone</a> and <a href="https://www.amazon.com/101-Places-Not-See-Before/dp/0061787760">101 Places Not to See Before You Die</a>.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and Catherine discuss digital distractions and their effects on our brains (2:00); reframing the way we think about our smartphones (9:30); being deliberate with our attention (12:30); setting ourselves up for success and creating the necessary "speed-bumps" (17:00); paying attention to our body (21:30); developing a technology-separation practice-trial, and using technology to protect ourselves from technology (29:00); and getting existential about how we think of time management (42:00).

For more from Catherine, check out her website at <a href="https://phonebreakup.com/home/">phonebreakup.com</a>

<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li>"<a href="http://www.oprah.com/spirit/learn-to-relax-with-mindfulness-meditatation/all">What Would It Take for You to Be Still?</a>" by Catherine Price (article)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/13/well/phone-cellphone-addiction-time.html">How to Break Up With Your Phone</a>" by Catherine Price (article)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_Tronick">Edward Tronick and the “Still Face Experiment”</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.umassmed.edu/cfm/">University of Massachusetts Center for Mindfulness</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2z2TbbL">The Craving Mind</a>, by Judson Brewer (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://freedom.to/">Freedom</a> (computer program and app)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://inboxwhenready.org">Inbox When Ready</a> (computer program)</li>
</ul>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                                    </description>
                <itunes:subtitle>
                    <![CDATA[ “Travel should not be a checklist; it should be about having new experiences” – Catherine Price

Catherine Price (@Catherine_Price) is a journalist and author of How to Break Up with Your Phone and 101 Places Not to See Before You Die.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf and Catherine discuss digital distractions and their effects on our brains (2:00); reframing the way we think about our smartphones (9:30); being deliberate with our attention (12:30); setting ourselves up for success and creating the necessary "speed-bumps" (17:00); paying attention to our body (21:30); developing a technology-separation practice-trial, and using technology to protect ourselves from technology (29:00); and getting existential about how we think of time management (42:00).

For more from Catherine, check out her website at phonebreakup.com

Notable Links:

 	"What Would It Take for You to Be Still?" by Catherine Price (article)
 	"How to Break Up With Your Phone" by Catherine Price (article)
 	Edward Tronick and the “Still Face Experiment”
 	University of Massachusetts Center for Mindfulness
 	The Craving Mind, by Judson Brewer (book)
 	Freedom (computer program and app)
 	Inbox When Ready (computer program)

The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album Lumber.

Note: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </itunes:subtitle>
                                <itunes:title>
                    <![CDATA[How to break up with your smartphone (and rediscover your real-world life)]]>
                </itunes:title>
                                                <itunes:explicit>false</itunes:explicit>
                <content:encoded>
                    <![CDATA[<em> “Travel should not be a checklist; it should be about having new experiences”</em> – Catherine Price

Catherine Price (<a href="https://twitter.com/catherine_price?lang=en">@Catherine_Price</a>) is a journalist and author of <a href="https://amzn.to/2tNJ4Tj">How to Break Up with Your Phone</a> and <a href="https://www.amazon.com/101-Places-Not-See-Before/dp/0061787760">101 Places Not to See Before You Die</a>.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and Catherine discuss digital distractions and their effects on our brains (2:00); reframing the way we think about our smartphones (9:30); being deliberate with our attention (12:30); setting ourselves up for success and creating the necessary "speed-bumps" (17:00); paying attention to our body (21:30); developing a technology-separation practice-trial, and using technology to protect ourselves from technology (29:00); and getting existential about how we think of time management (42:00).

For more from Catherine, check out her website at <a href="https://phonebreakup.com/home/">phonebreakup.com</a>

<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li>"<a href="http://www.oprah.com/spirit/learn-to-relax-with-mindfulness-meditatation/all">What Would It Take for You to Be Still?</a>" by Catherine Price (article)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/13/well/phone-cellphone-addiction-time.html">How to Break Up With Your Phone</a>" by Catherine Price (article)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_Tronick">Edward Tronick and the “Still Face Experiment”</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.umassmed.edu/cfm/">University of Massachusetts Center for Mindfulness</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2z2TbbL">The Craving Mind</a>, by Judson Brewer (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://freedom.to/">Freedom</a> (computer program and app)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://inboxwhenready.org">Inbox When Ready</a> (computer program)</li>
</ul>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </content:encoded>
                                    <enclosure url="https://episodes.castos.com/deviate/Deviate-036-Price.mp3" length=""
                        type="audio/mpeg">
                    </enclosure>
                                <itunes:summary>
                    <![CDATA[ “Travel should not be a checklist; it should be about having new experiences” – Catherine Price

Catherine Price (@Catherine_Price) is a journalist and author of How to Break Up with Your Phone and 101 Places Not to See Before You Die.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf and Catherine discuss digital distractions and their effects on our brains (2:00); reframing the way we think about our smartphones (9:30); being deliberate with our attention (12:30); setting ourselves up for success and creating the necessary "speed-bumps" (17:00); paying attention to our body (21:30); developing a technology-separation practice-trial, and using technology to protect ourselves from technology (29:00); and getting existential about how we think of time management (42:00).

For more from Catherine, check out her website at phonebreakup.com

Notable Links:

 	"What Would It Take for You to Be Still?" by Catherine Price (article)
 	"How to Break Up With Your Phone" by Catherine Price (article)
 	Edward Tronick and the “Still Face Experiment”
 	University of Massachusetts Center for Mindfulness
 	The Craving Mind, by Judson Brewer (book)
 	Freedom (computer program and app)
 	Inbox When Ready (computer program)

The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album Lumber.

Note: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </itunes:summary>
                                                                            <itunes:duration>00:45:44</itunes:duration>
                                                    <itunes:author>
                    <![CDATA[Rolf Potts]]>
                </itunes:author>
                            </item>
                    <item>
                <title>
                    <![CDATA[Classic rock is not dead. Classic rock is undead. Long live classic rock.]]>
                </title>
                <pubDate>Tue, 26 Jun 2018 00:01:20 +0000</pubDate>
                <dc:creator>Rolf Potts</dc:creator>
                <guid isPermaLink="true">
                    https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/podcasts/2160/episodes/-14288</guid>
                                    <link>https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/episodes/-14288</link>
                                <description>
                                            <![CDATA[<em>“Compared to the pop music that I was listening to at the time, there just seemed to be something deep and mysterious and enigmatic and sexy and scary about classic rock”</em> – Steven Hyden

Steven Hyden (<a href="https://twitter.com/Steven_Hyden?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor">@Steven_Hyden</a>) is a music critic. He currently works as a culture critic for UPROXX where he writes about all things music and hosts the <a href="https://uproxx.com/topic/celebration-rock-podcast/">Celebration Rock</a> podcast. His book, <em><a href="https://www.amazon.com/Twilight-Gods-Journey-Classic-Rock/dp/0062657127">Twilight of the Gods</a></em><em>,</em> is out now.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and Steven discuss the genesis of Classic Rock (2:00); the experience of interacting with music and how that interaction has changed over the years (12:00); Rock &amp; Roll as an aging art (25:00); and how we reckon with the transience of music (36:00).

For more from Steven, check out his UPROXX article archive at <a href="https://uproxx.com/author/steven-hyden/">https://uproxx.com/author/steven-hyden/</a>

<u>Notable links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><em><a href="https://www.amazon.com/Hammer-Gods-Stephen-Davis/dp/0425182134">Hammer of the Gods</a></em>, by Stephen Davis (book)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hype!">Hype!</a></em> (documentary film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_of_Theseus">Ship of Theseus</a> (thought experiment)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appetite_for_Destruction">Appetite for Destruction</a> (music album)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Joshua_Tree">The Joshua Tree</a> (music album)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Dark_Side_of_the_Moon">The Dark Side of the Moon</a> (music album)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pet_Sounds">Pet Sounds</a> (music album)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ram_(album)">Ram</a> (music album)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alternative_rock">Alternative rock</a> (genre of Rock &amp; Roll)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Rocks_Amphitheatre">Red Rocks Amphitheatre</a> (concert venue)</li>
</ul>
<u>Notable music bands / music artists mentioned:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eagles_(band)">Eagles</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pink_Floyd">Pink Floyd</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Rolling_Stones">The Rolling Stones</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Led_Zeppelin">Led Zeppelin</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fleetwood_Mac">Fleetwood Mac</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pearl_Jam">Pearl Jam</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nirvana_(band)">Nirvana</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_White_Stripes">The White Stripes</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Strokes">The Strokes</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Smashing_Pumpkins">Smashing Pumpkins</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metallica">Metallica</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jane%27s_Addiction">Jane’s Addiction</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AC/DC">AC/DC</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aerosmith">Aerosmith</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Van_Halen">Van Halen</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beyonc%C3%A9">Beyoncé</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_Ocean">Frank Ocean</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Marley">Bob Marley</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Journey_(band)">Journey</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/REO_Speedwagon">REO Speedwagon</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boston_(band)">Bost...</a></li></ul>]]>
                                    </description>
                <itunes:subtitle>
                    <![CDATA[“Compared to the pop music that I was listening to at the time, there just seemed to be something deep and mysterious and enigmatic and sexy and scary about classic rock” – Steven Hyden

Steven Hyden (@Steven_Hyden) is a music critic. He currently works as a culture critic for UPROXX where he writes about all things music and hosts the Celebration Rock podcast. His book, Twilight of the Gods, is out now.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf and Steven discuss the genesis of Classic Rock (2:00); the experience of interacting with music and how that interaction has changed over the years (12:00); Rock & Roll as an aging art (25:00); and how we reckon with the transience of music (36:00).

For more from Steven, check out his UPROXX article archive at https://uproxx.com/author/steven-hyden/

Notable links:

 	Hammer of the Gods, by Stephen Davis (book)
 	Hype! (documentary film)
 	Ship of Theseus (thought experiment)
 	Appetite for Destruction (music album)
 	The Joshua Tree (music album)
 	The Dark Side of the Moon (music album)
 	Pet Sounds (music album)
 	Ram (music album)
 	Alternative rock (genre of Rock & Roll)
 	Red Rocks Amphitheatre (concert venue)

Notable music bands / music artists mentioned:

 	Eagles
 	Pink Floyd
 	The Rolling Stones
 	Led Zeppelin
 	Fleetwood Mac
 	Pearl Jam
 	Nirvana
 	The White Stripes
 	The Strokes
 	Smashing Pumpkins
 	Metallica
 	Jane’s Addiction
 	AC/DC
 	Aerosmith
 	Van Halen
 	Beyoncé
 	Frank Ocean
 	Bob Marley
 	Journey
 	REO Speedwagon
 	Bost...]]>
                </itunes:subtitle>
                                <itunes:title>
                    <![CDATA[Classic rock is not dead. Classic rock is undead. Long live classic rock.]]>
                </itunes:title>
                                                <itunes:explicit>false</itunes:explicit>
                <content:encoded>
                    <![CDATA[<em>“Compared to the pop music that I was listening to at the time, there just seemed to be something deep and mysterious and enigmatic and sexy and scary about classic rock”</em> – Steven Hyden

Steven Hyden (<a href="https://twitter.com/Steven_Hyden?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor">@Steven_Hyden</a>) is a music critic. He currently works as a culture critic for UPROXX where he writes about all things music and hosts the <a href="https://uproxx.com/topic/celebration-rock-podcast/">Celebration Rock</a> podcast. His book, <em><a href="https://www.amazon.com/Twilight-Gods-Journey-Classic-Rock/dp/0062657127">Twilight of the Gods</a></em><em>,</em> is out now.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and Steven discuss the genesis of Classic Rock (2:00); the experience of interacting with music and how that interaction has changed over the years (12:00); Rock &amp; Roll as an aging art (25:00); and how we reckon with the transience of music (36:00).

For more from Steven, check out his UPROXX article archive at <a href="https://uproxx.com/author/steven-hyden/">https://uproxx.com/author/steven-hyden/</a>

<u>Notable links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><em><a href="https://www.amazon.com/Hammer-Gods-Stephen-Davis/dp/0425182134">Hammer of the Gods</a></em>, by Stephen Davis (book)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hype!">Hype!</a></em> (documentary film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_of_Theseus">Ship of Theseus</a> (thought experiment)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appetite_for_Destruction">Appetite for Destruction</a> (music album)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Joshua_Tree">The Joshua Tree</a> (music album)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Dark_Side_of_the_Moon">The Dark Side of the Moon</a> (music album)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pet_Sounds">Pet Sounds</a> (music album)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ram_(album)">Ram</a> (music album)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alternative_rock">Alternative rock</a> (genre of Rock &amp; Roll)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Rocks_Amphitheatre">Red Rocks Amphitheatre</a> (concert venue)</li>
</ul>
<u>Notable music bands / music artists mentioned:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eagles_(band)">Eagles</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pink_Floyd">Pink Floyd</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Rolling_Stones">The Rolling Stones</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Led_Zeppelin">Led Zeppelin</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fleetwood_Mac">Fleetwood Mac</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pearl_Jam">Pearl Jam</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nirvana_(band)">Nirvana</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_White_Stripes">The White Stripes</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Strokes">The Strokes</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Smashing_Pumpkins">Smashing Pumpkins</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metallica">Metallica</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jane%27s_Addiction">Jane’s Addiction</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AC/DC">AC/DC</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aerosmith">Aerosmith</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Van_Halen">Van Halen</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beyonc%C3%A9">Beyoncé</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_Ocean">Frank Ocean</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Marley">Bob Marley</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Journey_(band)">Journey</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/REO_Speedwagon">REO Speedwagon</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boston_(band)">Boston</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kansas_(band)">Kansas</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Styx_(band)">Styx</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_McCartney">Paul McCartney</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Beatles">The Beatles</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Dylan">Bob Dylan</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kanye_West">Kanye West</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cream_(band)">Cream</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queen_(band)">Queen</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grateful_Dead">Grateful Dead</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Mayer">John Mayer</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_Russo%27s_Almost_Dead">Joe Russo’s Almost Dead</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dead_%26_Company">Dead &amp; Company</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greta_Van_Fleet">Greta Van Fleet</a></li>
</ul>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>. Original episode art by <a href="https://www.aliciaard.com/">Alicia Ard</a> (whose services include branding, illustration, web design, and social media management).</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </content:encoded>
                                    <enclosure url="https://episodes.castos.com/deviate/Deviate-035-Hyden.mp3" length=""
                        type="audio/mpeg">
                    </enclosure>
                                <itunes:summary>
                    <![CDATA[“Compared to the pop music that I was listening to at the time, there just seemed to be something deep and mysterious and enigmatic and sexy and scary about classic rock” – Steven Hyden

Steven Hyden (@Steven_Hyden) is a music critic. He currently works as a culture critic for UPROXX where he writes about all things music and hosts the Celebration Rock podcast. His book, Twilight of the Gods, is out now.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf and Steven discuss the genesis of Classic Rock (2:00); the experience of interacting with music and how that interaction has changed over the years (12:00); Rock & Roll as an aging art (25:00); and how we reckon with the transience of music (36:00).

For more from Steven, check out his UPROXX article archive at https://uproxx.com/author/steven-hyden/

Notable links:

 	Hammer of the Gods, by Stephen Davis (book)
 	Hype! (documentary film)
 	Ship of Theseus (thought experiment)
 	Appetite for Destruction (music album)
 	The Joshua Tree (music album)
 	The Dark Side of the Moon (music album)
 	Pet Sounds (music album)
 	Ram (music album)
 	Alternative rock (genre of Rock & Roll)
 	Red Rocks Amphitheatre (concert venue)

Notable music bands / music artists mentioned:

 	Eagles
 	Pink Floyd
 	The Rolling Stones
 	Led Zeppelin
 	Fleetwood Mac
 	Pearl Jam
 	Nirvana
 	The White Stripes
 	The Strokes
 	Smashing Pumpkins
 	Metallica
 	Jane’s Addiction
 	AC/DC
 	Aerosmith
 	Van Halen
 	Beyoncé
 	Frank Ocean
 	Bob Marley
 	Journey
 	REO Speedwagon
 	Bost...]]>
                </itunes:summary>
                                                                            <itunes:duration>00:46:25</itunes:duration>
                                                    <itunes:author>
                    <![CDATA[Rolf Potts]]>
                </itunes:author>
                            </item>
                    <item>
                <title>
                    <![CDATA[Remembering Bourdain, and what we talk about when we talk about travel writing]]>
                </title>
                <pubDate>Tue, 19 Jun 2018 00:01:05 +0000</pubDate>
                <dc:creator>Rolf Potts</dc:creator>
                <guid isPermaLink="true">
                    https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/podcasts/2160/episodes/-13838</guid>
                                    <link>https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/episodes/-13838</link>
                                <description>
                                            <![CDATA[<em>“Every good story is two stories: the story of the place and the story of what happened to you as a result of being in that place”</em> – Alden Jones

<a href="http://www.eddyharris.com/biography.htm">Eddy Harris</a> (<a href="https://twitter.com/eddylharris?lang=en">@EddyLHarris</a>) is a writer, filmmaker, and author of <em><a href="https://amzn.to/2JVZ5wt">Mississippi Solo</a></em>, <em><a href="https://amzn.to/2lhTA0a">Native Stranger</a></em>, and <em><a href="https://amzn.to/2tguD92">Still Life in Harlem</a></em>. <a href="http://www.aldenjones.com/">Alden Jones</a> (<a href="https://twitter.com/jones_alden?lang=en">@jones_alden</a>) is an author and writer of <em><a href="https://amzn.to/2MBbBTS">The Blind Masseuse</a></em>. Thomas Swick (<a href="https://twitter.com/roostertie?lang=en">@roostertie</a>) is an author and writer of <em><a href="https://amzn.to/2LZvMcN">The Joys of</a></em><a href="https://amzn.to/2LZvMcN"> <em>Travel</em></a><em>, <a href="https://amzn.to/2MBb4B3">A Way to See the World</a></em>, and <em><a href="https://amzn.to/2t3TVrU">Unquiet Days</a></em>.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf, Eddy, Alden, and Thomas reflect on the legacy of Anthony Bourdain and the state of travel writing at large (3:00); common criticisms of travel writing (22:00); the notion of authenticity in travel and travel writing (34:00); what constitutes good travel writing, and the future of the genre (46:00).

<u>Books mentioned:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2t68QSn">Kitchen Confidential</a>, by Anthony Bourdain</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2lgl8mE">A Cook's Tour</a>, by Anthony Bourdain</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2t51m1Q">In Patagonia</a>, by Bruce Chatwin</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2lf3CPJ">Eat, Pray, Love</a>, by Elizabeth Gilbert</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2M2rhOR">Wild</a>, by Cheryl Strayed</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2M2TOnw">Abroad</a>, by Paul Fussell</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2LWTA15">The Pillars of Hercules</a>, by Paul Theroux</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2MBpXUf">Go Tell the Crocodiles</a>, by Rowan Moore Gerety</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2JMg9sP">White Man’s Game</a>, by Stephanie Hanes</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2yliTYD">Flaubert in Egypt</a>, by Gustave Flaubert</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2yl4v2N">Video Night in Kathmandu</a>, by Pico Iyer</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2MzTdut">Figures in a Landscape</a>, by Paul Theroux</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2JNohJy">What Belongs to You</a>, by Garth Greenwell (novel)</li>
</ul>
<u>Authors, articles, and other notable links</u>
<ul>
 	<li>"<a href="https://rolfpotts.com/anthony-bourdain/">Anthony Bourdain Did Not Speak Travelese</a>," by Rolf Potts</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://rolfpotts.com/around-the-world-in-80-hours-of-travel-tv/">Around the World in 80 Hours (of Travel TV)</a>," by Rolf Potts</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://granta.com/travel-writing-dead-colin-thubron/">Is Travel Writing Dead?</a>" <em>Granta</em> essay by Colin Thubron</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://www.ted.com/talks/chimamanda_adichie_the_danger_of_a_single_story">The danger of a single story</a>," by Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie (TED Talk)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.kwls.org/">Key West Literary Seminar</a> (writing conference)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jan_Morris">Jan Morris</a> (writer)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/pico-iyer/">Pico Iyer</a> (writer)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/tim-cahill/">Tim Cahill</a> (writer)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/paul-theroux/">Paul Theroux</a> (writer)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ryszard_Kapu%C5%9Bci%C5%84ski">Ryszard Kapuściński</a> (journalist)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Bryson">Bill Bryson</a> (author)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerald_Brenan">Gerald Brenan</a> (writer)</li>
 	<li><a href="http..."></a></li></ul>]]>
                                    </description>
                <itunes:subtitle>
                    <![CDATA[“Every good story is two stories: the story of the place and the story of what happened to you as a result of being in that place” – Alden Jones

Eddy Harris (@EddyLHarris) is a writer, filmmaker, and author of Mississippi Solo, Native Stranger, and Still Life in Harlem. Alden Jones (@jones_alden) is an author and writer of The Blind Masseuse. Thomas Swick (@roostertie) is an author and writer of The Joys of Travel, A Way to See the World, and Unquiet Days.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf, Eddy, Alden, and Thomas reflect on the legacy of Anthony Bourdain and the state of travel writing at large (3:00); common criticisms of travel writing (22:00); the notion of authenticity in travel and travel writing (34:00); what constitutes good travel writing, and the future of the genre (46:00).

Books mentioned:

 	Kitchen Confidential, by Anthony Bourdain
 	A Cook's Tour, by Anthony Bourdain
 	In Patagonia, by Bruce Chatwin
 	Eat, Pray, Love, by Elizabeth Gilbert
 	Wild, by Cheryl Strayed
 	Abroad, by Paul Fussell
 	The Pillars of Hercules, by Paul Theroux
 	Go Tell the Crocodiles, by Rowan Moore Gerety
 	White Man’s Game, by Stephanie Hanes
 	Flaubert in Egypt, by Gustave Flaubert
 	Video Night in Kathmandu, by Pico Iyer
 	Figures in a Landscape, by Paul Theroux
 	What Belongs to You, by Garth Greenwell (novel)

Authors, articles, and other notable links

 	"Anthony Bourdain Did Not Speak Travelese," by Rolf Potts
 	"Around the World in 80 Hours (of Travel TV)," by Rolf Potts
 	"Is Travel Writing Dead?" Granta essay by Colin Thubron
 	"The danger of a single story," by Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie (TED Talk)
 	Key West Literary Seminar (writing conference)
 	Jan Morris (writer)
 	Pico Iyer (writer)
 	Tim Cahill (writer)
 	Paul Theroux (writer)
 	Ryszard Kapuściński (journalist)
 	Bill Bryson (author)
 	Gerald Brenan (writer)
 	]]>
                </itunes:subtitle>
                                <itunes:title>
                    <![CDATA[Remembering Bourdain, and what we talk about when we talk about travel writing]]>
                </itunes:title>
                                                <itunes:explicit>false</itunes:explicit>
                <content:encoded>
                    <![CDATA[<em>“Every good story is two stories: the story of the place and the story of what happened to you as a result of being in that place”</em> – Alden Jones

<a href="http://www.eddyharris.com/biography.htm">Eddy Harris</a> (<a href="https://twitter.com/eddylharris?lang=en">@EddyLHarris</a>) is a writer, filmmaker, and author of <em><a href="https://amzn.to/2JVZ5wt">Mississippi Solo</a></em>, <em><a href="https://amzn.to/2lhTA0a">Native Stranger</a></em>, and <em><a href="https://amzn.to/2tguD92">Still Life in Harlem</a></em>. <a href="http://www.aldenjones.com/">Alden Jones</a> (<a href="https://twitter.com/jones_alden?lang=en">@jones_alden</a>) is an author and writer of <em><a href="https://amzn.to/2MBbBTS">The Blind Masseuse</a></em>. Thomas Swick (<a href="https://twitter.com/roostertie?lang=en">@roostertie</a>) is an author and writer of <em><a href="https://amzn.to/2LZvMcN">The Joys of</a></em><a href="https://amzn.to/2LZvMcN"> <em>Travel</em></a><em>, <a href="https://amzn.to/2MBb4B3">A Way to See the World</a></em>, and <em><a href="https://amzn.to/2t3TVrU">Unquiet Days</a></em>.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf, Eddy, Alden, and Thomas reflect on the legacy of Anthony Bourdain and the state of travel writing at large (3:00); common criticisms of travel writing (22:00); the notion of authenticity in travel and travel writing (34:00); what constitutes good travel writing, and the future of the genre (46:00).

<u>Books mentioned:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2t68QSn">Kitchen Confidential</a>, by Anthony Bourdain</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2lgl8mE">A Cook's Tour</a>, by Anthony Bourdain</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2t51m1Q">In Patagonia</a>, by Bruce Chatwin</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2lf3CPJ">Eat, Pray, Love</a>, by Elizabeth Gilbert</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2M2rhOR">Wild</a>, by Cheryl Strayed</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2M2TOnw">Abroad</a>, by Paul Fussell</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2LWTA15">The Pillars of Hercules</a>, by Paul Theroux</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2MBpXUf">Go Tell the Crocodiles</a>, by Rowan Moore Gerety</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2JMg9sP">White Man’s Game</a>, by Stephanie Hanes</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2yliTYD">Flaubert in Egypt</a>, by Gustave Flaubert</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2yl4v2N">Video Night in Kathmandu</a>, by Pico Iyer</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2MzTdut">Figures in a Landscape</a>, by Paul Theroux</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2JNohJy">What Belongs to You</a>, by Garth Greenwell (novel)</li>
</ul>
<u>Authors, articles, and other notable links</u>
<ul>
 	<li>"<a href="https://rolfpotts.com/anthony-bourdain/">Anthony Bourdain Did Not Speak Travelese</a>," by Rolf Potts</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://rolfpotts.com/around-the-world-in-80-hours-of-travel-tv/">Around the World in 80 Hours (of Travel TV)</a>," by Rolf Potts</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://granta.com/travel-writing-dead-colin-thubron/">Is Travel Writing Dead?</a>" <em>Granta</em> essay by Colin Thubron</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://www.ted.com/talks/chimamanda_adichie_the_danger_of_a_single_story">The danger of a single story</a>," by Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie (TED Talk)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.kwls.org/">Key West Literary Seminar</a> (writing conference)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jan_Morris">Jan Morris</a> (writer)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/pico-iyer/">Pico Iyer</a> (writer)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/tim-cahill/">Tim Cahill</a> (writer)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/podcast/paul-theroux/">Paul Theroux</a> (writer)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ryszard_Kapu%C5%9Bci%C5%84ski">Ryszard Kapuściński</a> (journalist)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Bryson">Bill Bryson</a> (author)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerald_Brenan">Gerald Brenan</a> (writer)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gertrude_Bell">Gertrude Bell</a> (author)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_Kingsley">Mary Kingsley</a> (writer and explorer)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/jeffrey-tayler/">Jeffrey Tayler</a> (journalist)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://granta.com/">Granta</a> (literary journal)</li>
 	<li><a href="http://www.panoramajournal.org/">Panorama: The Journal of Intelligent Travel</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Best_American_Travel_Writing">Best American Travel Writing</a> (book series)</li>
 	<li><a href="http://www.jasonwilson.com/about-me/">Jason Wilson</a> (writer and editor)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/amy-gigi-alexander/">Amy Gigi Alexander</a> (writer and editor)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cochabamba_Water_War">Cochabamba Water War</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Menu">U.S. bombing of Cambodia </a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cambodian_genocide">Cambodian genocide</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gorongosa_National_Park">Gorongosa National Park</a> (preserve in Mozambique)</li>
</ul>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </content:encoded>
                                    <enclosure url="https://episodes.castos.com/deviate/Deviate-034-Jones-Harris-Swick.mp3" length=""
                        type="audio/mpeg">
                    </enclosure>
                                <itunes:summary>
                    <![CDATA[“Every good story is two stories: the story of the place and the story of what happened to you as a result of being in that place” – Alden Jones

Eddy Harris (@EddyLHarris) is a writer, filmmaker, and author of Mississippi Solo, Native Stranger, and Still Life in Harlem. Alden Jones (@jones_alden) is an author and writer of The Blind Masseuse. Thomas Swick (@roostertie) is an author and writer of The Joys of Travel, A Way to See the World, and Unquiet Days.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf, Eddy, Alden, and Thomas reflect on the legacy of Anthony Bourdain and the state of travel writing at large (3:00); common criticisms of travel writing (22:00); the notion of authenticity in travel and travel writing (34:00); what constitutes good travel writing, and the future of the genre (46:00).

Books mentioned:

 	Kitchen Confidential, by Anthony Bourdain
 	A Cook's Tour, by Anthony Bourdain
 	In Patagonia, by Bruce Chatwin
 	Eat, Pray, Love, by Elizabeth Gilbert
 	Wild, by Cheryl Strayed
 	Abroad, by Paul Fussell
 	The Pillars of Hercules, by Paul Theroux
 	Go Tell the Crocodiles, by Rowan Moore Gerety
 	White Man’s Game, by Stephanie Hanes
 	Flaubert in Egypt, by Gustave Flaubert
 	Video Night in Kathmandu, by Pico Iyer
 	Figures in a Landscape, by Paul Theroux
 	What Belongs to You, by Garth Greenwell (novel)

Authors, articles, and other notable links

 	"Anthony Bourdain Did Not Speak Travelese," by Rolf Potts
 	"Around the World in 80 Hours (of Travel TV)," by Rolf Potts
 	"Is Travel Writing Dead?" Granta essay by Colin Thubron
 	"The danger of a single story," by Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie (TED Talk)
 	Key West Literary Seminar (writing conference)
 	Jan Morris (writer)
 	Pico Iyer (writer)
 	Tim Cahill (writer)
 	Paul Theroux (writer)
 	Ryszard Kapuściński (journalist)
 	Bill Bryson (author)
 	Gerald Brenan (writer)
 	]]>
                </itunes:summary>
                                                                            <itunes:duration>01:06:33</itunes:duration>
                                                    <itunes:author>
                    <![CDATA[Rolf Potts]]>
                </itunes:author>
                            </item>
                    <item>
                <title>
                    <![CDATA[Why 1980s coming-of-age movies matter]]>
                </title>
                <pubDate>Tue, 12 Jun 2018 00:01:12 +0000</pubDate>
                <dc:creator>Rolf Potts</dc:creator>
                <guid isPermaLink="true">
                    https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/podcasts/2160/episodes/-13416</guid>
                                    <link>https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/episodes/-13416</link>
                                <description>
                                            <![CDATA[<em>"John Hughes, and really all of best 1980s teen movies, were saying that the stories of teenagers are the stories of all of us. They have the same human need and longing that the stories of adults have."</em> —Kevin Smokler

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf discusses classic coming-of-age films with <a href="http://www.kevinsmokler.com/#sthash.bG7dD3Up.dpbs">Kevin Smokler</a> (<a href="https://twitter.com/weegee">@Weegee</a>), author of <a href="https://amzn.to/2sW5zUL"><em>Brat Pack America: A Love Letter to '80s Teen Movies</em></a>.

The discussion themes, cultural references, and time-codes that outline this expansive conversation are as follows:

<hr />

<h4><img class="wp-image-6925 aligncenter" src="https://rolfpotts.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Stand-By-Me-300x169.png" alt="" width="583" height="328" /></h4>
<h4><strong>Kids having adult adventures movies</strong></h4>
[2:30 - 17:00]

<u>Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stand_by_Me_(film)">Stand By Me</a> (1986 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2sM7yfb"><em>Different Seasons</em></a>, by Stephen King (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rob_Reiner">Rob Reiner</a> (film director)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Wire_(season_4)">Season 4 of <em>The Wire</em></a> (TV season)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Simon">David Simon</a> (TV writer-producer)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boyz_n_the_Hood">Boyz in the Hood</a> (1991 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Singleton">John Singleton</a> (film director)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://rolfpotts.com/coming-of-age-movie-songs/">12 Great Coming-Of-Age Movie Final-Scene Songs</a>," by Rolf Potts</li>
</ul>

<hr />

<h4><img class="wp-image-6926 aligncenter" src="https://rolfpotts.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Breakfast-Club-300x171.png" alt="" width="602" height="343" /></h4>
<h4><strong>Emblematic teen movies</strong></h4>
[17:00 -45:10]

<u>Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Breakfast_Club">Breakfast Club</a> (1985 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Hughes_(filmmaker)">John Hughes</a> (filmmaker)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sixteen_Candles">Sixteen Candles</a> (1984 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_Duk_Dong">Long Duk Dong</a> (Sixteen Candles character)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apu_Nahasapeemapetilon">Apu Nahasapeemapetilon</a> (Simpsons character)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hari_Kondabolu">Hari Kondabolu</a> (standup comic)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2HDHcjR">How to American</a></em>, by Jimmy O. Yang (memoir)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fresh_Off_the_Boat">Fresh Off the Boat</a> (TV show)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fast_Times_at_Ridgemont_High">Fast Times at Ridgemont High</a> (1982 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Say_Anything...">Say Anything</a> (1989 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cameron_Crowe">Cameron Crowe</a> (writer-director)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Mahoney">John Mahoney</a> (actor)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ione_Skye">Ione Skye</a> (actress)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heathers">Heathers</a> (1989 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Waters_(screenwriter)">Daniel Waters</a> (screenwriter)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riot_grrrl">Riot grrrl</a> (feminist punk movement)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dead_Poets_Society">Dead Poets Society</a> (1989 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dylan_Kussman">Dylan Kussman</a> (actor)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norman_Lloyd">Norman Lloyd</a> (actor)</li>
 	<li><a></a></li></ul>]]>
                                    </description>
                <itunes:subtitle>
                    <![CDATA["John Hughes, and really all of best 1980s teen movies, were saying that the stories of teenagers are the stories of all of us. They have the same human need and longing that the stories of adults have." —Kevin Smokler

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf discusses classic coming-of-age films with Kevin Smokler (@Weegee), author of Brat Pack America: A Love Letter to '80s Teen Movies.

The discussion themes, cultural references, and time-codes that outline this expansive conversation are as follows:




Kids having adult adventures movies
[2:30 - 17:00]

Links:

 	Stand By Me (1986 film)
 	Different Seasons, by Stephen King (book)
 	Rob Reiner (film director)
 	Season 4 of The Wire (TV season)
 	David Simon (TV writer-producer)
 	Boyz in the Hood (1991 film)
 	John Singleton (film director)
 	"12 Great Coming-Of-Age Movie Final-Scene Songs," by Rolf Potts





Emblematic teen movies
[17:00 -45:10]

Links:

 	Breakfast Club (1985 film)
 	John Hughes (filmmaker)
 	Sixteen Candles (1984 film)
 	Long Duk Dong (Sixteen Candles character)
 	Apu Nahasapeemapetilon (Simpsons character)
 	Hari Kondabolu (standup comic)
 	How to American, by Jimmy O. Yang (memoir)
 	Fresh Off the Boat (TV show)
 	Fast Times at Ridgemont High (1982 film)
 	Say Anything (1989 film)
 	Cameron Crowe (writer-director)
 	John Mahoney (actor)
 	Ione Skye (actress)
 	Heathers (1989 film)
 	Daniel Waters (screenwriter)
 	Riot grrrl (feminist punk movement)
 	Dead Poets Society (1989 film)
 	Dylan Kussman (actor)
 	Norman Lloyd (actor)
 	]]>
                </itunes:subtitle>
                                <itunes:title>
                    <![CDATA[Why 1980s coming-of-age movies matter]]>
                </itunes:title>
                                                <itunes:explicit>false</itunes:explicit>
                <content:encoded>
                    <![CDATA[<em>"John Hughes, and really all of best 1980s teen movies, were saying that the stories of teenagers are the stories of all of us. They have the same human need and longing that the stories of adults have."</em> —Kevin Smokler

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf discusses classic coming-of-age films with <a href="http://www.kevinsmokler.com/#sthash.bG7dD3Up.dpbs">Kevin Smokler</a> (<a href="https://twitter.com/weegee">@Weegee</a>), author of <a href="https://amzn.to/2sW5zUL"><em>Brat Pack America: A Love Letter to '80s Teen Movies</em></a>.

The discussion themes, cultural references, and time-codes that outline this expansive conversation are as follows:

<hr />

<h4><img class="wp-image-6925 aligncenter" src="https://rolfpotts.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Stand-By-Me-300x169.png" alt="" width="583" height="328" /></h4>
<h4><strong>Kids having adult adventures movies</strong></h4>
[2:30 - 17:00]

<u>Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stand_by_Me_(film)">Stand By Me</a> (1986 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2sM7yfb"><em>Different Seasons</em></a>, by Stephen King (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rob_Reiner">Rob Reiner</a> (film director)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Wire_(season_4)">Season 4 of <em>The Wire</em></a> (TV season)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Simon">David Simon</a> (TV writer-producer)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boyz_n_the_Hood">Boyz in the Hood</a> (1991 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Singleton">John Singleton</a> (film director)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://rolfpotts.com/coming-of-age-movie-songs/">12 Great Coming-Of-Age Movie Final-Scene Songs</a>," by Rolf Potts</li>
</ul>

<hr />

<h4><img class="wp-image-6926 aligncenter" src="https://rolfpotts.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Breakfast-Club-300x171.png" alt="" width="602" height="343" /></h4>
<h4><strong>Emblematic teen movies</strong></h4>
[17:00 -45:10]

<u>Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Breakfast_Club">Breakfast Club</a> (1985 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Hughes_(filmmaker)">John Hughes</a> (filmmaker)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sixteen_Candles">Sixteen Candles</a> (1984 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_Duk_Dong">Long Duk Dong</a> (Sixteen Candles character)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apu_Nahasapeemapetilon">Apu Nahasapeemapetilon</a> (Simpsons character)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hari_Kondabolu">Hari Kondabolu</a> (standup comic)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2HDHcjR">How to American</a></em>, by Jimmy O. Yang (memoir)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fresh_Off_the_Boat">Fresh Off the Boat</a> (TV show)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fast_Times_at_Ridgemont_High">Fast Times at Ridgemont High</a> (1982 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Say_Anything...">Say Anything</a> (1989 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cameron_Crowe">Cameron Crowe</a> (writer-director)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Mahoney">John Mahoney</a> (actor)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ione_Skye">Ione Skye</a> (actress)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heathers">Heathers</a> (1989 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Waters_(screenwriter)">Daniel Waters</a> (screenwriter)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riot_grrrl">Riot grrrl</a> (feminist punk movement)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dead_Poets_Society">Dead Poets Society</a> (1989 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dylan_Kussman">Dylan Kussman</a> (actor)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norman_Lloyd">Norman Lloyd</a> (actor)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carpe_diem">Carpe Diem</a> (<em>Dead Poets Society</em> Latin aphorism)</li>
</ul>

<hr />

<h4><img class="wp-image-6927 aligncenter" src="https://rolfpotts.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Ferris-Bueller-300x172.png" alt="" width="597" height="342" /></h4>
<h4><strong>Quirky teen fantasy movies</strong></h4>
[45:10 -1:06:10]

<u>Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferris_Bueller%27s_Day_Off">Ferris Bueller's Day Off</a> (1986 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matthew_Broderick">Matthew Broderick</a> (actor)</li>
 	<li>John Hughes <a href="http://screencrush.com/ferris-bueller-audio-commentary/">director's commentary</a> on <em>Ferris Bueller</em></li>
 	<li><a href="http://www.screenplay.com/downloads/scripts/FerrisBuellersDayOff.pdf"><em>Ferris Bueller's Day Off</em> screenplay</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Home_Alone">Home Alone</a> (1990 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Back_to_the_Future">Back to the Future</a> (1985 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2y2sUd8"><em>Life Moves Pretty Fast</em></a>, by Hadley Freeman (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Risky_Business">Risky Business</a> (1983 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tangerine_Dream">Tangerine Dream</a> (electronic music band)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Brickman">Paul Brickman</a> (writer-director)</li>
</ul>

<hr />

<h4><img class="wp-image-6928 aligncenter" src="https://rolfpotts.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Dazed-300x162.png" alt="" width="587" height="317" /></h4>
<h4><strong>One crazy night movies</strong></h4>
[1:06:10 -1:19:00]

<u>Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dazed_and_Confused_(film)">Dazed and Confused</a> (1993 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Linklater">Richard Linklater</a> (writer-director)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quentin_Tarantino">Quentin Tarantino</a> (writer-director)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Graffiti">American Graffiti</a> (1973 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Everybody_Wants_Some!!_(film)">Everybody Wants Some!!</a> (2016 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slacker_(film)">Slacker</a> (1991 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boyhood_(film)">Boyhood</a> (2014 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Before_Sunrise">Before Sunrise</a> (1995 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Before_Sunset">Before Sunset</a> (2004 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Before_Midnight_(film)">Before Midnight</a> (2013 film)</li>
</ul>

<hr />

<h4><img class="wp-image-6929 aligncenter" src="https://rolfpotts.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Rivers-Edge-300x185.png" alt="" width="609" height="375" /></h4>
<h4><strong>Dark teen movies</strong></h4>
[1:19:00 - 1:25:00]

<u>Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/River%27s_Edge">River's Edge</a> (1986 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Marcy_Renee_Conrad">Murder of Marcy Renee Conrad</a> (inspiration for <em>River's Edge</em>)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dennis_Hopper">Dennis Hopper</a> (actor)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keanu_Reeves">Keanu Reeves</a> (actor)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satanic_ritual_abuse">Satanic panic</a> (1980s moral panic)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Over_the_Edge_(film)">Over the Edge</a> (1979 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Legend_of_Billie_Jean">The Legend of Bill Jean</a> (1985 film)</li>
</ul>

<hr />

<h4><img class="wp-image-6930 aligncenter" src="https://rolfpotts.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/FNL-300x169.png" alt="" width="594" height="335" /></h4>
<h4><strong>Teen sports movies with strong sense of place</strong></h4>
[1:25:00 -1:32:40]

<u>Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breaking_Away">Breaking Away</a> (1979 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2JFHSu7"><em>Friday Night Lights</em></a>, by Buzz Bissinger (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friday_Night_Lights_(film)">Friday Night Lights</a> (2004 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friday_Night_Lights_(TV_series)">Friday Night Lights</a> (TV series)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/All_the_Right_Moves_(film)">All the Right Moves</a> (1983 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hoosiers_(film)">Hoosiers</a> (1986 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Remember_the_Titans">Remember the Titans</a> (2000 film)</li>
</ul>

<hr />

<h4><img class="wp-image-6931 aligncenter" src="https://rolfpotts.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Almost-Famous-300x171.png" alt="" width="603" height="344" /></h4>
<h4><strong>Autobiographical coming-of-age movies</strong></h4>
[1:32:40 -1:51:30]

<u>Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Almost_Famous">Almost Famous</a> (2000 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://youtu.be/bhwGPwDbbRM">"Tiny Dancer" scene</a> from <em>Almost Famous</em></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freaks_and_Geeks">Freaks and Geeks</a> (TV series)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Feig">Paul Feig</a> (TV writer)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judd_Apatow">Judd Apatow</a> (TV producer)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jason_Segel">Jason Segel</a> (actor)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Seger">Bob Seger</a> (singer-songwriter)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/My_So-Called_Life">My So-Called Life</a> (TV series)</li>
</ul>

<hr />

<h4><img class="wp-image-6932 aligncenter" src="https://rolfpotts.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Stranger-Things-300x171.png" alt="" width="593" height="338" /></h4>
<h4><strong>21st century coming-of-age movies and TV shows</strong></h4>
[1:51:30 - 2:01:00]

<u>Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stranger_Things">Stranger Things</a> (TV series)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Everything_Sucks!">Everything Sucks!</a> (TV series)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lady_Bird_(film)">Lady Bird</a> (2017 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greta_Gerwig">Greta Gerwig</a> (writer-director)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Real_Women_Have_Curves">Real Women Have Curves</a> (2002 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dope_(2015_film)">Dope</a> (2015 film)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Love,_Simon">Love, Simon</a> (2018 film)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://rolfpotts.com/stranger-things-5-differences-between-the-pilot-script-and-the-first-episode/">Stranger Things: 5 Differences Between the Pilot Script and the First Episode</a>," by Rolf Potts</li>
</ul>

<hr />

<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </content:encoded>
                                    <enclosure url="https://episodes.castos.com/deviate/Deviate-033-Smokler.mp3" length=""
                        type="audio/mpeg">
                    </enclosure>
                                <itunes:summary>
                    <![CDATA["John Hughes, and really all of best 1980s teen movies, were saying that the stories of teenagers are the stories of all of us. They have the same human need and longing that the stories of adults have." —Kevin Smokler

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf discusses classic coming-of-age films with Kevin Smokler (@Weegee), author of Brat Pack America: A Love Letter to '80s Teen Movies.

The discussion themes, cultural references, and time-codes that outline this expansive conversation are as follows:




Kids having adult adventures movies
[2:30 - 17:00]

Links:

 	Stand By Me (1986 film)
 	Different Seasons, by Stephen King (book)
 	Rob Reiner (film director)
 	Season 4 of The Wire (TV season)
 	David Simon (TV writer-producer)
 	Boyz in the Hood (1991 film)
 	John Singleton (film director)
 	"12 Great Coming-Of-Age Movie Final-Scene Songs," by Rolf Potts





Emblematic teen movies
[17:00 -45:10]

Links:

 	Breakfast Club (1985 film)
 	John Hughes (filmmaker)
 	Sixteen Candles (1984 film)
 	Long Duk Dong (Sixteen Candles character)
 	Apu Nahasapeemapetilon (Simpsons character)
 	Hari Kondabolu (standup comic)
 	How to American, by Jimmy O. Yang (memoir)
 	Fresh Off the Boat (TV show)
 	Fast Times at Ridgemont High (1982 film)
 	Say Anything (1989 film)
 	Cameron Crowe (writer-director)
 	John Mahoney (actor)
 	Ione Skye (actress)
 	Heathers (1989 film)
 	Daniel Waters (screenwriter)
 	Riot grrrl (feminist punk movement)
 	Dead Poets Society (1989 film)
 	Dylan Kussman (actor)
 	Norman Lloyd (actor)
 	]]>
                </itunes:summary>
                                                                            <itunes:duration>02:02:05</itunes:duration>
                                                    <itunes:author>
                    <![CDATA[Rolf Potts]]>
                </itunes:author>
                            </item>
                    <item>
                <title>
                    <![CDATA[How to talk to someone who is grieving the loss of a loved one]]>
                </title>
                <pubDate>Tue, 05 Jun 2018 00:01:51 +0000</pubDate>
                <dc:creator>Rolf Potts</dc:creator>
                <guid isPermaLink="true">
                    https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/podcasts/2160/episodes/-12907</guid>
                                    <link>https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/episodes/-12907</link>
                                <description>
                                            <![CDATA[<em> “The greatest blessing for me, from having all these losses, has been the otherworldly, supreme clarity about what’s important to me—about how much I love and how much I am loved.”</em> – Heather Dobbins

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf, Heather Dobbins, and Jamie-Lee Josselyn discuss personal loss, grief and mourning, including the importance of gestures over words (2:30); the rituals that surround loss and mourning (18:00); the task of facing holidays and difficult moments in the years following a personal loss (30:00); and funerals and bearing witness to the life and death of loved ones (44:00).

Heather Dobbins, is a teacher, poet, and writer of <em><a href="https://amzn.to/2Jcr9PX">In the Low Houses</a></em> and <em><a href="https://amzn.to/2sxjelJ">River Mouth</a></em>. Jamie-Lee Josselyn (<a href="https://twitter.com/jljosselyn?lang=en">@jljosselyn</a>), is a creative writing instructor, essayist, and host of the <a href="https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/dead-parents-society/id1372504018">Dead Parents Society</a> podcast.

<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rainer_Maria_Rilke">Rainer Maria Rilke</a> (poet)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://www.poemhunter.com/poem/a-coffin-is-a-small-domain/">A Coffin—is A Small Domain</a>," by Emily Dickinson</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2sEyL2x">The Book of Psalms: A Translation</a> (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2LmSF9X">Guests of My Life</a>, by Elizabeth Watson (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2LW7cdO">Elegy: Poems</a>, by Mary Jo Bang (book)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poetrymagazine/poems/49508/you-were-you-are-elegy">You Were You Are Elegy</a>," by Mary Jo Bang</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Letterman">David Letterman</a> (television host)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Annie_Dillard">Annie Dillard</a> (author)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Six_Feet_Under_(TV_series)">Six Feet Under</a> (television series)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freaks_and_Geeks">Freaks and Geeks</a> (television series)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Legend_of_Zelda">The Legend of Zelda</a> (video game series)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sudden_unexplained_death_in_childhood">Sudden unexplained death in childhood</a></li>
 	<li><a href="http://writing.upenn.edu/wh/">The Kelly Writers House</a></li>
</ul>
<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                                    </description>
                <itunes:subtitle>
                    <![CDATA[ “The greatest blessing for me, from having all these losses, has been the otherworldly, supreme clarity about what’s important to me—about how much I love and how much I am loved.” – Heather Dobbins

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf, Heather Dobbins, and Jamie-Lee Josselyn discuss personal loss, grief and mourning, including the importance of gestures over words (2:30); the rituals that surround loss and mourning (18:00); the task of facing holidays and difficult moments in the years following a personal loss (30:00); and funerals and bearing witness to the life and death of loved ones (44:00).

Heather Dobbins, is a teacher, poet, and writer of In the Low Houses and River Mouth. Jamie-Lee Josselyn (@jljosselyn), is a creative writing instructor, essayist, and host of the Dead Parents Society podcast.

Notable Links:

 	Rainer Maria Rilke (poet)
 	"A Coffin—is A Small Domain," by Emily Dickinson
 	The Book of Psalms: A Translation (book)
 	Guests of My Life, by Elizabeth Watson (book)
 	Elegy: Poems, by Mary Jo Bang (book)
 	"You Were You Are Elegy," by Mary Jo Bang
 	David Letterman (television host)
 	Annie Dillard (author)
 	Six Feet Under (television series)
 	Freaks and Geeks (television series)
 	The Legend of Zelda (video game series)
 	Sudden unexplained death in childhood
 	The Kelly Writers House

Note: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </itunes:subtitle>
                                <itunes:title>
                    <![CDATA[How to talk to someone who is grieving the loss of a loved one]]>
                </itunes:title>
                                                <itunes:explicit>false</itunes:explicit>
                <content:encoded>
                    <![CDATA[<em> “The greatest blessing for me, from having all these losses, has been the otherworldly, supreme clarity about what’s important to me—about how much I love and how much I am loved.”</em> – Heather Dobbins

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf, Heather Dobbins, and Jamie-Lee Josselyn discuss personal loss, grief and mourning, including the importance of gestures over words (2:30); the rituals that surround loss and mourning (18:00); the task of facing holidays and difficult moments in the years following a personal loss (30:00); and funerals and bearing witness to the life and death of loved ones (44:00).

Heather Dobbins, is a teacher, poet, and writer of <em><a href="https://amzn.to/2Jcr9PX">In the Low Houses</a></em> and <em><a href="https://amzn.to/2sxjelJ">River Mouth</a></em>. Jamie-Lee Josselyn (<a href="https://twitter.com/jljosselyn?lang=en">@jljosselyn</a>), is a creative writing instructor, essayist, and host of the <a href="https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/dead-parents-society/id1372504018">Dead Parents Society</a> podcast.

<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rainer_Maria_Rilke">Rainer Maria Rilke</a> (poet)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://www.poemhunter.com/poem/a-coffin-is-a-small-domain/">A Coffin—is A Small Domain</a>," by Emily Dickinson</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2sEyL2x">The Book of Psalms: A Translation</a> (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2LmSF9X">Guests of My Life</a>, by Elizabeth Watson (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2LW7cdO">Elegy: Poems</a>, by Mary Jo Bang (book)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poetrymagazine/poems/49508/you-were-you-are-elegy">You Were You Are Elegy</a>," by Mary Jo Bang</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Letterman">David Letterman</a> (television host)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Annie_Dillard">Annie Dillard</a> (author)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Six_Feet_Under_(TV_series)">Six Feet Under</a> (television series)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freaks_and_Geeks">Freaks and Geeks</a> (television series)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Legend_of_Zelda">The Legend of Zelda</a> (video game series)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sudden_unexplained_death_in_childhood">Sudden unexplained death in childhood</a></li>
 	<li><a href="http://writing.upenn.edu/wh/">The Kelly Writers House</a></li>
</ul>
<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </content:encoded>
                                    <enclosure url="https://episodes.castos.com/deviate/Deviate-032-Dobbins-Josselyn.mp3" length=""
                        type="audio/mpeg">
                    </enclosure>
                                <itunes:summary>
                    <![CDATA[ “The greatest blessing for me, from having all these losses, has been the otherworldly, supreme clarity about what’s important to me—about how much I love and how much I am loved.” – Heather Dobbins

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf, Heather Dobbins, and Jamie-Lee Josselyn discuss personal loss, grief and mourning, including the importance of gestures over words (2:30); the rituals that surround loss and mourning (18:00); the task of facing holidays and difficult moments in the years following a personal loss (30:00); and funerals and bearing witness to the life and death of loved ones (44:00).

Heather Dobbins, is a teacher, poet, and writer of In the Low Houses and River Mouth. Jamie-Lee Josselyn (@jljosselyn), is a creative writing instructor, essayist, and host of the Dead Parents Society podcast.

Notable Links:

 	Rainer Maria Rilke (poet)
 	"A Coffin—is A Small Domain," by Emily Dickinson
 	The Book of Psalms: A Translation (book)
 	Guests of My Life, by Elizabeth Watson (book)
 	Elegy: Poems, by Mary Jo Bang (book)
 	"You Were You Are Elegy," by Mary Jo Bang
 	David Letterman (television host)
 	Annie Dillard (author)
 	Six Feet Under (television series)
 	Freaks and Geeks (television series)
 	The Legend of Zelda (video game series)
 	Sudden unexplained death in childhood
 	The Kelly Writers House

Note: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </itunes:summary>
                                                                            <itunes:duration>01:04:07</itunes:duration>
                                                    <itunes:author>
                    <![CDATA[Rolf Potts]]>
                </itunes:author>
                            </item>
                    <item>
                <title>
                    <![CDATA[Paul Theroux on the art of listening, and the necessary obstacles of deep travel]]>
                </title>
                <pubDate>Tue, 29 May 2018 00:01:55 +0000</pubDate>
                <dc:creator>Rolf Potts</dc:creator>
                <guid isPermaLink="true">
                    https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/podcasts/2160/episodes/-12239</guid>
                                    <link>https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/episodes/-12239</link>
                                <description>
                                            <![CDATA[<em>"All writing is trying to destroy a stereotype, and the individual that you're writing about -- the figure in the landscape -- is actually the ideal."</em> —Paul Theroux

<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Theroux">Paul Theroux</a>'s highly acclaimed novels include <em>Blinding Light</em>, <em>My Other Life</em>, and <em>The Mosquito Coast</em>. His 1975 book <em>The Great Railway Bazaar</em> is credited with revitalizing the genre of literary travel writing, and his more recent travel books include <em>Ghost Train to the Eastern Star</em>, <em>Dark Star Safari</em>, and <em>The Last Train to Zona Verde</em>.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and Paul talk about Theroux's new book <em><a href="https://amzn.to/2KW8qo5">Figures in a Landscape</a></em>, and strategies for writing about the "human architecture of a place" (4:30); the attitude and time-investment required for meaningful travel reportage (19:30); the qualities that determine successful travel writing (24:50); the essential discomforts and obstacles of travel (31:45); the uses and shortcomings of paper maps in developing countries (39:15); and where Paul is traveling next (45:00).

<u>Books, articles, and films mentioned</u>
<ul>
 	<li>"<a href="https://www.theatlantic.com/entertainment/archive/2011/05/paul-theroux-on-blogging-travel-writing-and-three-cups-of-tea/238955/">Paul Theroux on Blogging, Travel Writing, and 'Three Cups of Tea'</a>" (2011 Atlantic interview)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2J75eZf">The Great Railway Bazaar</a></em>, by Paul Theroux</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2J94Iu2">The Mosquito Coast</a></em>, by Paul Theroux</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2IIYdOV">The Tao of Travel</a></em>, by Paul Theroux</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2LuFFzK">Deep South</a></em>, by Paul Theroux</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2xf3Qzc">American Notes</a></em>, by Charles Dickens</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2IJjyb2">Barbary Shore</a></em>, by Norman Mailer</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2IMluQ2">Journey Without Maps</a></em>, by Graham Greene</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2IKauCW">Sea and Sardinia</a></em>, by D.H. Lawrence</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2KWOv8D">Travels</a></em>, by Ibn Battuta</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2IL51Mh">Travels</a></em>, by Marco Polo</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2GNpYjK">Lafcadio Hearn's Japan: An Anthology</a> </em></li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2KUHvc2">India: A Million Mutinies Now</a></em>, by V.S. Naipaul</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://www.smithsonianmag.com/travel/paul-therouxs-quest-to-define-hawaii-61158475/">Paul Theroux’s Quest to Define Hawaii</a>" (2012 Smithsonian article)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandalay_(poem)">Mandalay</a>," by Rudyard Kipling (poem)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rashomon">Rashomon</a></em> (1950 Akira Kurosawa film)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Life_and_Death_of_Colonel_Blimp">The Life and Death of Colonel Blimp</a></em> (1943 film)</li>
</ul>
<u>People mentioned</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doris_Lessing">Doris Lessing</a> (novelist and poet)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom_Wolfe">Tom Wolfe</a> (author and journalist)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robin_williams">Robin Williams</a> (actor and comedian)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elizabeth_Taylor">Elizabeth Taylor</a> (actress)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Jackson">Michael Jackson</a> (singer-songwriter)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rod_Steiger">Rod Steiger</a> (actor)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike_Nichols">Mike Nichols</a> (film director)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margaret_Mead">Margaret Mead</a> (anthropologist)</li>
 	<li><a></a></li></ul>]]>
                                    </description>
                <itunes:subtitle>
                    <![CDATA["All writing is trying to destroy a stereotype, and the individual that you're writing about -- the figure in the landscape -- is actually the ideal." —Paul Theroux

Paul Theroux's highly acclaimed novels include Blinding Light, My Other Life, and The Mosquito Coast. His 1975 book The Great Railway Bazaar is credited with revitalizing the genre of literary travel writing, and his more recent travel books include Ghost Train to the Eastern Star, Dark Star Safari, and The Last Train to Zona Verde.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf and Paul talk about Theroux's new book Figures in a Landscape, and strategies for writing about the "human architecture of a place" (4:30); the attitude and time-investment required for meaningful travel reportage (19:30); the qualities that determine successful travel writing (24:50); the essential discomforts and obstacles of travel (31:45); the uses and shortcomings of paper maps in developing countries (39:15); and where Paul is traveling next (45:00).

Books, articles, and films mentioned

 	"Paul Theroux on Blogging, Travel Writing, and 'Three Cups of Tea'" (2011 Atlantic interview)
 	The Great Railway Bazaar, by Paul Theroux
 	The Mosquito Coast, by Paul Theroux
 	The Tao of Travel, by Paul Theroux
 	Deep South, by Paul Theroux
 	American Notes, by Charles Dickens
 	Barbary Shore, by Norman Mailer
 	Journey Without Maps, by Graham Greene
 	Sea and Sardinia, by D.H. Lawrence
 	Travels, by Ibn Battuta
 	Travels, by Marco Polo
 	Lafcadio Hearn's Japan: An Anthology 
 	India: A Million Mutinies Now, by V.S. Naipaul
 	"Paul Theroux’s Quest to Define Hawaii" (2012 Smithsonian article)
 	"Mandalay," by Rudyard Kipling (poem)
 	Rashomon (1950 Akira Kurosawa film)
 	The Life and Death of Colonel Blimp (1943 film)

People mentioned

 	Doris Lessing (novelist and poet)
 	Tom Wolfe (author and journalist)
 	Robin Williams (actor and comedian)
 	Elizabeth Taylor (actress)
 	Michael Jackson (singer-songwriter)
 	Rod Steiger (actor)
 	Mike Nichols (film director)
 	Margaret Mead (anthropologist)
 	]]>
                </itunes:subtitle>
                                <itunes:title>
                    <![CDATA[Paul Theroux on the art of listening, and the necessary obstacles of deep travel]]>
                </itunes:title>
                                                <itunes:explicit>false</itunes:explicit>
                <content:encoded>
                    <![CDATA[<em>"All writing is trying to destroy a stereotype, and the individual that you're writing about -- the figure in the landscape -- is actually the ideal."</em> —Paul Theroux

<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Theroux">Paul Theroux</a>'s highly acclaimed novels include <em>Blinding Light</em>, <em>My Other Life</em>, and <em>The Mosquito Coast</em>. His 1975 book <em>The Great Railway Bazaar</em> is credited with revitalizing the genre of literary travel writing, and his more recent travel books include <em>Ghost Train to the Eastern Star</em>, <em>Dark Star Safari</em>, and <em>The Last Train to Zona Verde</em>.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and Paul talk about Theroux's new book <em><a href="https://amzn.to/2KW8qo5">Figures in a Landscape</a></em>, and strategies for writing about the "human architecture of a place" (4:30); the attitude and time-investment required for meaningful travel reportage (19:30); the qualities that determine successful travel writing (24:50); the essential discomforts and obstacles of travel (31:45); the uses and shortcomings of paper maps in developing countries (39:15); and where Paul is traveling next (45:00).

<u>Books, articles, and films mentioned</u>
<ul>
 	<li>"<a href="https://www.theatlantic.com/entertainment/archive/2011/05/paul-theroux-on-blogging-travel-writing-and-three-cups-of-tea/238955/">Paul Theroux on Blogging, Travel Writing, and 'Three Cups of Tea'</a>" (2011 Atlantic interview)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2J75eZf">The Great Railway Bazaar</a></em>, by Paul Theroux</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2J94Iu2">The Mosquito Coast</a></em>, by Paul Theroux</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2IIYdOV">The Tao of Travel</a></em>, by Paul Theroux</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2LuFFzK">Deep South</a></em>, by Paul Theroux</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2xf3Qzc">American Notes</a></em>, by Charles Dickens</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2IJjyb2">Barbary Shore</a></em>, by Norman Mailer</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2IMluQ2">Journey Without Maps</a></em>, by Graham Greene</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2IKauCW">Sea and Sardinia</a></em>, by D.H. Lawrence</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2KWOv8D">Travels</a></em>, by Ibn Battuta</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2IL51Mh">Travels</a></em>, by Marco Polo</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2GNpYjK">Lafcadio Hearn's Japan: An Anthology</a> </em></li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2KUHvc2">India: A Million Mutinies Now</a></em>, by V.S. Naipaul</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://www.smithsonianmag.com/travel/paul-therouxs-quest-to-define-hawaii-61158475/">Paul Theroux’s Quest to Define Hawaii</a>" (2012 Smithsonian article)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandalay_(poem)">Mandalay</a>," by Rudyard Kipling (poem)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rashomon">Rashomon</a></em> (1950 Akira Kurosawa film)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Life_and_Death_of_Colonel_Blimp">The Life and Death of Colonel Blimp</a></em> (1943 film)</li>
</ul>
<u>People mentioned</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doris_Lessing">Doris Lessing</a> (novelist and poet)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom_Wolfe">Tom Wolfe</a> (author and journalist)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robin_williams">Robin Williams</a> (actor and comedian)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elizabeth_Taylor">Elizabeth Taylor</a> (actress)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Jackson">Michael Jackson</a> (singer-songwriter)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rod_Steiger">Rod Steiger</a> (actor)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike_Nichols">Mike Nichols</a> (film director)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margaret_Mead">Margaret Mead</a> (anthropologist)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colin_Turnbull">Colin Turnbull</a> (anthropologist)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bronis%C5%82aw_Malinowski">Bronislaw Malinowski</a> (anthropologist)</li>
</ul>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </content:encoded>
                                    <enclosure url="https://episodes.castos.com/deviate/Deviate-031-Theroux.mp3" length=""
                        type="audio/mpeg">
                    </enclosure>
                                <itunes:summary>
                    <![CDATA["All writing is trying to destroy a stereotype, and the individual that you're writing about -- the figure in the landscape -- is actually the ideal." —Paul Theroux

Paul Theroux's highly acclaimed novels include Blinding Light, My Other Life, and The Mosquito Coast. His 1975 book The Great Railway Bazaar is credited with revitalizing the genre of literary travel writing, and his more recent travel books include Ghost Train to the Eastern Star, Dark Star Safari, and The Last Train to Zona Verde.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf and Paul talk about Theroux's new book Figures in a Landscape, and strategies for writing about the "human architecture of a place" (4:30); the attitude and time-investment required for meaningful travel reportage (19:30); the qualities that determine successful travel writing (24:50); the essential discomforts and obstacles of travel (31:45); the uses and shortcomings of paper maps in developing countries (39:15); and where Paul is traveling next (45:00).

Books, articles, and films mentioned

 	"Paul Theroux on Blogging, Travel Writing, and 'Three Cups of Tea'" (2011 Atlantic interview)
 	The Great Railway Bazaar, by Paul Theroux
 	The Mosquito Coast, by Paul Theroux
 	The Tao of Travel, by Paul Theroux
 	Deep South, by Paul Theroux
 	American Notes, by Charles Dickens
 	Barbary Shore, by Norman Mailer
 	Journey Without Maps, by Graham Greene
 	Sea and Sardinia, by D.H. Lawrence
 	Travels, by Ibn Battuta
 	Travels, by Marco Polo
 	Lafcadio Hearn's Japan: An Anthology 
 	India: A Million Mutinies Now, by V.S. Naipaul
 	"Paul Theroux’s Quest to Define Hawaii" (2012 Smithsonian article)
 	"Mandalay," by Rudyard Kipling (poem)
 	Rashomon (1950 Akira Kurosawa film)
 	The Life and Death of Colonel Blimp (1943 film)

People mentioned

 	Doris Lessing (novelist and poet)
 	Tom Wolfe (author and journalist)
 	Robin Williams (actor and comedian)
 	Elizabeth Taylor (actress)
 	Michael Jackson (singer-songwriter)
 	Rod Steiger (actor)
 	Mike Nichols (film director)
 	Margaret Mead (anthropologist)
 	]]>
                </itunes:summary>
                                                                            <itunes:duration>00:49:52</itunes:duration>
                                                    <itunes:author>
                    <![CDATA[Rolf Potts]]>
                </itunes:author>
                            </item>
                    <item>
                <title>
                    <![CDATA[The way we grow food has been broken for 10,000 years (but we can fix it)]]>
                </title>
                <pubDate>Tue, 22 May 2018 00:01:18 +0000</pubDate>
                <dc:creator>Rolf Potts</dc:creator>
                <guid isPermaLink="true">
                    https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/podcasts/2160/episodes/-11756</guid>
                                    <link>https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/episodes/-11756</link>
                                <description>
                                            <![CDATA[<em>“I think the fate of humanity ultimately rests on how we conserve and protect that thin, magical layer of soil on this planet”</em> – David Van Tassel

<a href="https://landinstitute.org/about-us/staff/david-van-tassel/">David Van Tassel</a> is a lead scientist at <a href="https://landinstitute.org/">The Land Institute</a>, a non-profit research, education, and policy organization dedicated to sustainable agriculture.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and David discuss Agriculture 101 (3:00); the impact of agriculture on the formation of society (25:00); farming, modernity, and the Green Revolution (39:00); The Land Institute and the push to develop perennial staple plants (47:00); and politics and the long game of sustainable agriculture (1:13:00).

<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perennial_plant">Perennial plant</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Annual_plant">Annual plant</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Green_Revolution">Green Revolution</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evolutionary_biology">Evolutionary biology</a> (subfield of biology)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_selection">Sexual selection</a> (mode of <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_selection">natural selection</a>)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Origin_of_the_domestic_dog">Origin of domestic dogs</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monoculture">Monoculture</a> (agricultural practice)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polyculture">Polyculture</a> (agricultural practice)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thinopyrum_intermedium">Kernza</a> (perennial grass)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silphium">Silphium</a> (perennial sunflower)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Upland_rice">Upland rice</a> (type of rice)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japonica_rice">Japonica rice</a> (type of rice)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oryza_sativa">Indica rice</a> (type of rice)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Columbian_Exchange">Columbian Exchange</a></li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2IWc9o8">Farmers of Forty Centuries</a>,</em> by F.H. King (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://landinstitute.org/about-us/staff/wes-jackson/">Wes Jackson</a> (Founder and President, The Land Institute)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2kauWho"><em>Nature as Measure</em></a>, by Wes Jackson (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maya_civilization">Maya Civilization</a> (ancient civilization)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancestral_Puebloans">Anasazi</a> (ancient civilization)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesopotamia">Mesopotamia</a> (historical region)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_Egyptian_agriculture">Ancient Egyptian agriculture</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://landinstitute.org/scientific-pub/land-institute-scientist-jerry-glover-recognized/">Jerry Glover</a> (soil scientist at The Land Institute)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scree">Scree</a> (geological feature)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loess">Loess</a> (type of soil)</li>
</ul>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                                    </description>
                <itunes:subtitle>
                    <![CDATA[“I think the fate of humanity ultimately rests on how we conserve and protect that thin, magical layer of soil on this planet” – David Van Tassel

David Van Tassel is a lead scientist at The Land Institute, a non-profit research, education, and policy organization dedicated to sustainable agriculture.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf and David discuss Agriculture 101 (3:00); the impact of agriculture on the formation of society (25:00); farming, modernity, and the Green Revolution (39:00); The Land Institute and the push to develop perennial staple plants (47:00); and politics and the long game of sustainable agriculture (1:13:00).

Notable Links:

 	Perennial plant
 	Annual plant
 	Green Revolution
 	Evolutionary biology (subfield of biology)
 	Sexual selection (mode of natural selection)
 	Origin of domestic dogs
 	Monoculture (agricultural practice)
 	Polyculture (agricultural practice)
 	Kernza (perennial grass)
 	Silphium (perennial sunflower)
 	Upland rice (type of rice)
 	Japonica rice (type of rice)
 	Indica rice (type of rice)
 	Columbian Exchange
 	Farmers of Forty Centuries, by F.H. King (book)
 	Wes Jackson (Founder and President, The Land Institute)
 	Nature as Measure, by Wes Jackson (book)
 	Maya Civilization (ancient civilization)
 	Anasazi (ancient civilization)
 	Mesopotamia (historical region)
 	Ancient Egyptian agriculture
 	Jerry Glover (soil scientist at The Land Institute)
 	Scree (geological feature)
 	Loess (type of soil)

The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album Lumber.

Note: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </itunes:subtitle>
                                <itunes:title>
                    <![CDATA[The way we grow food has been broken for 10,000 years (but we can fix it)]]>
                </itunes:title>
                                                <itunes:explicit>false</itunes:explicit>
                <content:encoded>
                    <![CDATA[<em>“I think the fate of humanity ultimately rests on how we conserve and protect that thin, magical layer of soil on this planet”</em> – David Van Tassel

<a href="https://landinstitute.org/about-us/staff/david-van-tassel/">David Van Tassel</a> is a lead scientist at <a href="https://landinstitute.org/">The Land Institute</a>, a non-profit research, education, and policy organization dedicated to sustainable agriculture.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and David discuss Agriculture 101 (3:00); the impact of agriculture on the formation of society (25:00); farming, modernity, and the Green Revolution (39:00); The Land Institute and the push to develop perennial staple plants (47:00); and politics and the long game of sustainable agriculture (1:13:00).

<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perennial_plant">Perennial plant</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Annual_plant">Annual plant</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Green_Revolution">Green Revolution</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evolutionary_biology">Evolutionary biology</a> (subfield of biology)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_selection">Sexual selection</a> (mode of <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_selection">natural selection</a>)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Origin_of_the_domestic_dog">Origin of domestic dogs</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monoculture">Monoculture</a> (agricultural practice)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polyculture">Polyculture</a> (agricultural practice)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thinopyrum_intermedium">Kernza</a> (perennial grass)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silphium">Silphium</a> (perennial sunflower)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Upland_rice">Upland rice</a> (type of rice)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japonica_rice">Japonica rice</a> (type of rice)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oryza_sativa">Indica rice</a> (type of rice)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Columbian_Exchange">Columbian Exchange</a></li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2IWc9o8">Farmers of Forty Centuries</a>,</em> by F.H. King (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://landinstitute.org/about-us/staff/wes-jackson/">Wes Jackson</a> (Founder and President, The Land Institute)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2kauWho"><em>Nature as Measure</em></a>, by Wes Jackson (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maya_civilization">Maya Civilization</a> (ancient civilization)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancestral_Puebloans">Anasazi</a> (ancient civilization)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesopotamia">Mesopotamia</a> (historical region)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_Egyptian_agriculture">Ancient Egyptian agriculture</a></li>
 	<li><a href="https://landinstitute.org/scientific-pub/land-institute-scientist-jerry-glover-recognized/">Jerry Glover</a> (soil scientist at The Land Institute)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scree">Scree</a> (geological feature)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loess">Loess</a> (type of soil)</li>
</ul>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </content:encoded>
                                    <enclosure url="https://episodes.castos.com/deviate/Deviate-030-Van-Tassel.mp3" length=""
                        type="audio/mpeg">
                    </enclosure>
                                <itunes:summary>
                    <![CDATA[“I think the fate of humanity ultimately rests on how we conserve and protect that thin, magical layer of soil on this planet” – David Van Tassel

David Van Tassel is a lead scientist at The Land Institute, a non-profit research, education, and policy organization dedicated to sustainable agriculture.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf and David discuss Agriculture 101 (3:00); the impact of agriculture on the formation of society (25:00); farming, modernity, and the Green Revolution (39:00); The Land Institute and the push to develop perennial staple plants (47:00); and politics and the long game of sustainable agriculture (1:13:00).

Notable Links:

 	Perennial plant
 	Annual plant
 	Green Revolution
 	Evolutionary biology (subfield of biology)
 	Sexual selection (mode of natural selection)
 	Origin of domestic dogs
 	Monoculture (agricultural practice)
 	Polyculture (agricultural practice)
 	Kernza (perennial grass)
 	Silphium (perennial sunflower)
 	Upland rice (type of rice)
 	Japonica rice (type of rice)
 	Indica rice (type of rice)
 	Columbian Exchange
 	Farmers of Forty Centuries, by F.H. King (book)
 	Wes Jackson (Founder and President, The Land Institute)
 	Nature as Measure, by Wes Jackson (book)
 	Maya Civilization (ancient civilization)
 	Anasazi (ancient civilization)
 	Mesopotamia (historical region)
 	Ancient Egyptian agriculture
 	Jerry Glover (soil scientist at The Land Institute)
 	Scree (geological feature)
 	Loess (type of soil)

The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album Lumber.

Note: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </itunes:summary>
                                                                            <itunes:duration>01:28:16</itunes:duration>
                                                    <itunes:author>
                    <![CDATA[Rolf Potts]]>
                </itunes:author>
                            </item>
                    <item>
                <title>
                    <![CDATA[Kevin Kelly on the lost world of 1970s Asia (and why you should travel now)]]>
                </title>
                <pubDate>Tue, 15 May 2018 00:01:36 +0000</pubDate>
                <dc:creator>Rolf Potts</dc:creator>
                <guid isPermaLink="true">
                    https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/podcasts/2160/episodes/-11330</guid>
                                    <link>https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/episodes/-11330</link>
                                <description>
                                            <![CDATA[<em>"I met people who would say, 'I wish I had more time to travel like you do.' They had more money than time, and I had more time than money. In terms of traveling it's much better to have more time than more money. ...If you have a chance to travel, just do it. You won't regret it."</em> – Kevin Kelly

<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kevin_Kelly_(editor)">Kevin Kelly</a> (<a href="https://twitter.com/kevin2kelly?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor">@kevin2kelly</a>) is a polymath in the truest sense of the word. Aside from being a co-founder of <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wired_(magazine)">Wired</a> magazine, he is also co-founder of the <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosetta_Project">Rosetta Project</a>, which is aiming to build an archive of all documented human languages, and he serves on the board of the <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_Now_Foundation">Long Now Foundation</a>. He is a photographer, writer, and futurist (he was “futurist adviser” on the 2002 <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steven_Spielberg">Steven Spielberg</a> movie, <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minority_Report_(film)"><em>Minority Report</em></a>), with much of his work centering on Asian and digital culture.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and Kevin discuss the inspiration for his Asia travel in the 1970s (3:00); getting around and dealing with language barriers (15:00); the people he encountered while traveling in Asia, and the life-expanding nature of his journey (32:00); what he packed (47:00); modernity and technology in Asia, and managing his photography during travel (1:07:00); and self-actualization, discovering oneself through travel, and what the future holds in Asia.

For more on Kevin, check out <a href="http://kk.org/">http://kk.org/</a>

<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2KikAr1">Asia Grace</a></em>, by Kevin Kelly (photography book)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://www.thisamericanlife.org/50/shoulda-been-dead">Shoulda Been Dead</a>" (<em>This American Life</em> episode on Kevin’s Jerusalem conversion experience)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2Koqhnn">Out of Control</a></em>, by Kevin Kelly (book)</li>
 	<li>Kevin Kelly's <a href="https://tim.blog/2014/08/29/kevin-kelly/">interview with Tim Ferriss</a> (podcast episode)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="http://kk.org/thetechnium/1000-true-fans/">1000 True Fans</a>" by Kevin Kelly (essay)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aerogram">Aerogram</a> (pre-stamped airmail envelope)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poste_restante">Poste restante</a> (postal pick-up service for travelers)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maureen_Wheeler">Maureen Wheeler</a> (publisher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tony_Wheeler">Tony Wheeler</a> (publisher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rick_Steves">Rick Steves</a> (travel writer and publisher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hilary_Bradt">Hilary Bradt</a> (guidebook publisher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/bill-dalton/">Bill Dalton</a> (guidebook publisher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lonely_Planet">Lonely Planet</a> (travel guidebook)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moon_Publications">Moon Guide</a> (travel guidebook)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rough_Guides">Rough Guides</a> (travel guidebook)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.nationalgeographic.com/magazine/">National Geographic</a> (magazine)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2rGoWkZ">Video Night in Kathmandu</a>, by Pico Iyer (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.amazon.com/Leaves-Grass-Original-Walt-Whitman/dp/1945644273">Leaves of Grass</a>, by Walt Whitman (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hippie_trail">Hippie Trail</a> (travel route)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://rolfpotts.com/remembering-the-hippie..."></a></li></ul>]]>
                                    </description>
                <itunes:subtitle>
                    <![CDATA["I met people who would say, 'I wish I had more time to travel like you do.' They had more money than time, and I had more time than money. In terms of traveling it's much better to have more time than more money. ...If you have a chance to travel, just do it. You won't regret it." – Kevin Kelly

Kevin Kelly (@kevin2kelly) is a polymath in the truest sense of the word. Aside from being a co-founder of Wired magazine, he is also co-founder of the Rosetta Project, which is aiming to build an archive of all documented human languages, and he serves on the board of the Long Now Foundation. He is a photographer, writer, and futurist (he was “futurist adviser” on the 2002 Steven Spielberg movie, Minority Report), with much of his work centering on Asian and digital culture.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf and Kevin discuss the inspiration for his Asia travel in the 1970s (3:00); getting around and dealing with language barriers (15:00); the people he encountered while traveling in Asia, and the life-expanding nature of his journey (32:00); what he packed (47:00); modernity and technology in Asia, and managing his photography during travel (1:07:00); and self-actualization, discovering oneself through travel, and what the future holds in Asia.

For more on Kevin, check out http://kk.org/

Notable Links:

 	Asia Grace, by Kevin Kelly (photography book)
 	"Shoulda Been Dead" (This American Life episode on Kevin’s Jerusalem conversion experience)
 	Out of Control, by Kevin Kelly (book)
 	Kevin Kelly's interview with Tim Ferriss (podcast episode)
 	"1000 True Fans" by Kevin Kelly (essay)
 	Aerogram (pre-stamped airmail envelope)
 	Poste restante (postal pick-up service for travelers)
 	Maureen Wheeler (publisher)
 	Tony Wheeler (publisher)
 	Rick Steves (travel writer and publisher)
 	Hilary Bradt (guidebook publisher)
 	Bill Dalton (guidebook publisher)
 	Lonely Planet (travel guidebook)
 	Moon Guide (travel guidebook)
 	Rough Guides (travel guidebook)
 	National Geographic (magazine)
 	Video Night in Kathmandu, by Pico Iyer (book)
 	Leaves of Grass, by Walt Whitman (book)
 	Hippie Trail (travel route)
 	"]]>
                </itunes:subtitle>
                                <itunes:title>
                    <![CDATA[Kevin Kelly on the lost world of 1970s Asia (and why you should travel now)]]>
                </itunes:title>
                                                <itunes:explicit>false</itunes:explicit>
                <content:encoded>
                    <![CDATA[<em>"I met people who would say, 'I wish I had more time to travel like you do.' They had more money than time, and I had more time than money. In terms of traveling it's much better to have more time than more money. ...If you have a chance to travel, just do it. You won't regret it."</em> – Kevin Kelly

<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kevin_Kelly_(editor)">Kevin Kelly</a> (<a href="https://twitter.com/kevin2kelly?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor">@kevin2kelly</a>) is a polymath in the truest sense of the word. Aside from being a co-founder of <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wired_(magazine)">Wired</a> magazine, he is also co-founder of the <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosetta_Project">Rosetta Project</a>, which is aiming to build an archive of all documented human languages, and he serves on the board of the <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_Now_Foundation">Long Now Foundation</a>. He is a photographer, writer, and futurist (he was “futurist adviser” on the 2002 <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steven_Spielberg">Steven Spielberg</a> movie, <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minority_Report_(film)"><em>Minority Report</em></a>), with much of his work centering on Asian and digital culture.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and Kevin discuss the inspiration for his Asia travel in the 1970s (3:00); getting around and dealing with language barriers (15:00); the people he encountered while traveling in Asia, and the life-expanding nature of his journey (32:00); what he packed (47:00); modernity and technology in Asia, and managing his photography during travel (1:07:00); and self-actualization, discovering oneself through travel, and what the future holds in Asia.

For more on Kevin, check out <a href="http://kk.org/">http://kk.org/</a>

<u>Notable Links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2KikAr1">Asia Grace</a></em>, by Kevin Kelly (photography book)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://www.thisamericanlife.org/50/shoulda-been-dead">Shoulda Been Dead</a>" (<em>This American Life</em> episode on Kevin’s Jerusalem conversion experience)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2Koqhnn">Out of Control</a></em>, by Kevin Kelly (book)</li>
 	<li>Kevin Kelly's <a href="https://tim.blog/2014/08/29/kevin-kelly/">interview with Tim Ferriss</a> (podcast episode)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="http://kk.org/thetechnium/1000-true-fans/">1000 True Fans</a>" by Kevin Kelly (essay)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aerogram">Aerogram</a> (pre-stamped airmail envelope)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poste_restante">Poste restante</a> (postal pick-up service for travelers)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maureen_Wheeler">Maureen Wheeler</a> (publisher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tony_Wheeler">Tony Wheeler</a> (publisher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rick_Steves">Rick Steves</a> (travel writer and publisher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hilary_Bradt">Hilary Bradt</a> (guidebook publisher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://rolfpotts.com/bill-dalton/">Bill Dalton</a> (guidebook publisher)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lonely_Planet">Lonely Planet</a> (travel guidebook)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moon_Publications">Moon Guide</a> (travel guidebook)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rough_Guides">Rough Guides</a> (travel guidebook)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.nationalgeographic.com/magazine/">National Geographic</a> (magazine)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2rGoWkZ">Video Night in Kathmandu</a>, by Pico Iyer (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.amazon.com/Leaves-Grass-Original-Walt-Whitman/dp/1945644273">Leaves of Grass</a>, by Walt Whitman (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hippie_trail">Hippie Trail</a> (travel route)</li>
 	<li>"<a href="https://rolfpotts.com/remembering-the-hippie-trail/">Remembering the Hippie Trail</a>" by Rolf Potts (essay)</li>
 	<li><a href="http://recomendo.com/">Recomendo</a> (weekly recommendation newsletter)</li>
</ul>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </content:encoded>
                                    <enclosure url="https://episodes.castos.com/deviate/Deviate-029-Kelly.mp3" length=""
                        type="audio/mpeg">
                    </enclosure>
                                <itunes:summary>
                    <![CDATA["I met people who would say, 'I wish I had more time to travel like you do.' They had more money than time, and I had more time than money. In terms of traveling it's much better to have more time than more money. ...If you have a chance to travel, just do it. You won't regret it." – Kevin Kelly

Kevin Kelly (@kevin2kelly) is a polymath in the truest sense of the word. Aside from being a co-founder of Wired magazine, he is also co-founder of the Rosetta Project, which is aiming to build an archive of all documented human languages, and he serves on the board of the Long Now Foundation. He is a photographer, writer, and futurist (he was “futurist adviser” on the 2002 Steven Spielberg movie, Minority Report), with much of his work centering on Asian and digital culture.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf and Kevin discuss the inspiration for his Asia travel in the 1970s (3:00); getting around and dealing with language barriers (15:00); the people he encountered while traveling in Asia, and the life-expanding nature of his journey (32:00); what he packed (47:00); modernity and technology in Asia, and managing his photography during travel (1:07:00); and self-actualization, discovering oneself through travel, and what the future holds in Asia.

For more on Kevin, check out http://kk.org/

Notable Links:

 	Asia Grace, by Kevin Kelly (photography book)
 	"Shoulda Been Dead" (This American Life episode on Kevin’s Jerusalem conversion experience)
 	Out of Control, by Kevin Kelly (book)
 	Kevin Kelly's interview with Tim Ferriss (podcast episode)
 	"1000 True Fans" by Kevin Kelly (essay)
 	Aerogram (pre-stamped airmail envelope)
 	Poste restante (postal pick-up service for travelers)
 	Maureen Wheeler (publisher)
 	Tony Wheeler (publisher)
 	Rick Steves (travel writer and publisher)
 	Hilary Bradt (guidebook publisher)
 	Bill Dalton (guidebook publisher)
 	Lonely Planet (travel guidebook)
 	Moon Guide (travel guidebook)
 	Rough Guides (travel guidebook)
 	National Geographic (magazine)
 	Video Night in Kathmandu, by Pico Iyer (book)
 	Leaves of Grass, by Walt Whitman (book)
 	Hippie Trail (travel route)
 	"]]>
                </itunes:summary>
                                                                            <itunes:duration>01:45:02</itunes:duration>
                                                    <itunes:author>
                    <![CDATA[Rolf Potts]]>
                </itunes:author>
                            </item>
                    <item>
                <title>
                    <![CDATA[Kink Doctor Dulcinea Pitagora on sex therapy, BDSM, and dominatrix work]]>
                </title>
                <pubDate>Tue, 08 May 2018 00:01:59 +0000</pubDate>
                <dc:creator>Rolf Potts</dc:creator>
                <guid isPermaLink="true">
                    https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/podcasts/2160/episodes/-10812</guid>
                                    <link>https://deviate-with-rolf-potts-2-1.castos.com/episodes/-10812</link>
                                <description>
                                            <![CDATA[<em>"My specializations come from who I am. I'm a little unusual in the therapy field because I state very clearly what my identifications are. Which is that I'm kinky, and that I'm poly, and that I identify as queer, and that I'm gender fluid, and that I'm a former sex worker."</em> --Dulcinea Pitagora

Dulcinea Pitagora (<a href="https://twitter.com/kinkdoctor">@KinkDoctor</a>) is a New York-based psychotherapist specializing in alternative sexuality. She is the host of the web series <em><a href="http://kinkdoctor.com/">Kink Doctor</a></em>.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and Dulcinea discuss the specifics of dominatrix work (2:00); the difficulties and hurdles involved with dominatrix and other sex work (25:00); Dulcinea's personal path into sex work and sex therapy (31:00); sex therapy and alternative sexualities (47:00); and <em>Fifty Shades of Grey</em> and public perceptions of kink (1:00:00).

For more on Dulcinea, check out <a href="http://www.dulcineapitagora.com">http://www.dulcineapitagora.com</a>

<u>Sex terms dicussed:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cisgender">Cisgender</a> (gender identity)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genderqueer">Non-binary/gender fluidity</a> (gender identity)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/painplay">Pain play</a> (sex practice)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_roleplay">Role play</a> (sex practice)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BDSM">BDSM/power exchange</a> (sex practice)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conventional_sex">Vanilla</a> (sex behavior)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kink_(sexual)">Kink</a> (sex behavior)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Safeword">Safe word</a> (BDSM communication)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_fetishism">Fetish</a> (sexual fixation)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polyamory">Polyamory</a> (relationship practice)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.reddit.com/r/StraightPegging/">"Pegging" for straight men</a> (Subreddit page, NSFW)</li>
</ul>
<u>Other links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2IoFDLm">The Erotic Mind</a></em>, by Jack Morin (book)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2rr3IHA">Perv</a>,</em> by Jesse Bering (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2rvf5xw"><em>Modern Sexuality</em></a>, by Michael Aaron (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2KJ988D"><em>Sexual Outsiders: Understanding BSM Sexualities</em></a>, by David Ortmann and Richard Sprott (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2jDd52q"><em>Rewriting the Rules</em></a>, by Meg John Barker (book)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2K2GJcT">50 Shades of Grey</a></em>, by E.L. James (novel)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tristan_Taormino">Tristan Taormino</a> (feminist author)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Janet_Hardy">Janet Hardy</a> (sex educator)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://fetlife.com/">FetLife</a> (social networking for kinky people)</li>
 	<li><a href="http://altsexnycconference.org/">AltSex NYC</a> (conference)</li>
 	<li><a href="http://www.manhattanalternative.com/">Manhattan Alternative</a> (sex-positive therapist coalition)</li>
</ul>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                                    </description>
                <itunes:subtitle>
                    <![CDATA["My specializations come from who I am. I'm a little unusual in the therapy field because I state very clearly what my identifications are. Which is that I'm kinky, and that I'm poly, and that I identify as queer, and that I'm gender fluid, and that I'm a former sex worker." --Dulcinea Pitagora

Dulcinea Pitagora (@KinkDoctor) is a New York-based psychotherapist specializing in alternative sexuality. She is the host of the web series Kink Doctor.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf and Dulcinea discuss the specifics of dominatrix work (2:00); the difficulties and hurdles involved with dominatrix and other sex work (25:00); Dulcinea's personal path into sex work and sex therapy (31:00); sex therapy and alternative sexualities (47:00); and Fifty Shades of Grey and public perceptions of kink (1:00:00).

For more on Dulcinea, check out http://www.dulcineapitagora.com

Sex terms dicussed:

 	Cisgender (gender identity)
 	Non-binary/gender fluidity (gender identity)
 	Pain play (sex practice)
 	Role play (sex practice)
 	BDSM/power exchange (sex practice)
 	Vanilla (sex behavior)
 	Kink (sex behavior)
 	Safe word (BDSM communication)
 	Fetish (sexual fixation)
 	Polyamory (relationship practice)
 	"Pegging" for straight men (Subreddit page, NSFW)

Other links:

 	The Erotic Mind, by Jack Morin (book)
 	Perv, by Jesse Bering (book)
 	Modern Sexuality, by Michael Aaron (book)
 	Sexual Outsiders: Understanding BSM Sexualities, by David Ortmann and Richard Sprott (book)
 	Rewriting the Rules, by Meg John Barker (book)
 	50 Shades of Grey, by E.L. James (novel)
 	Tristan Taormino (feminist author)
 	Janet Hardy (sex educator)
 	FetLife (social networking for kinky people)
 	AltSex NYC (conference)
 	Manhattan Alternative (sex-positive therapist coalition)

The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album Lumber.

Note: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </itunes:subtitle>
                                <itunes:title>
                    <![CDATA[Kink Doctor Dulcinea Pitagora on sex therapy, BDSM, and dominatrix work]]>
                </itunes:title>
                                                <itunes:explicit>false</itunes:explicit>
                <content:encoded>
                    <![CDATA[<em>"My specializations come from who I am. I'm a little unusual in the therapy field because I state very clearly what my identifications are. Which is that I'm kinky, and that I'm poly, and that I identify as queer, and that I'm gender fluid, and that I'm a former sex worker."</em> --Dulcinea Pitagora

Dulcinea Pitagora (<a href="https://twitter.com/kinkdoctor">@KinkDoctor</a>) is a New York-based psychotherapist specializing in alternative sexuality. She is the host of the web series <em><a href="http://kinkdoctor.com/">Kink Doctor</a></em>.

In this episode of <em>Deviate</em>, Rolf and Dulcinea discuss the specifics of dominatrix work (2:00); the difficulties and hurdles involved with dominatrix and other sex work (25:00); Dulcinea's personal path into sex work and sex therapy (31:00); sex therapy and alternative sexualities (47:00); and <em>Fifty Shades of Grey</em> and public perceptions of kink (1:00:00).

For more on Dulcinea, check out <a href="http://www.dulcineapitagora.com">http://www.dulcineapitagora.com</a>

<u>Sex terms dicussed:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cisgender">Cisgender</a> (gender identity)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genderqueer">Non-binary/gender fluidity</a> (gender identity)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/painplay">Pain play</a> (sex practice)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_roleplay">Role play</a> (sex practice)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BDSM">BDSM/power exchange</a> (sex practice)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conventional_sex">Vanilla</a> (sex behavior)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kink_(sexual)">Kink</a> (sex behavior)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Safeword">Safe word</a> (BDSM communication)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_fetishism">Fetish</a> (sexual fixation)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polyamory">Polyamory</a> (relationship practice)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://www.reddit.com/r/StraightPegging/">"Pegging" for straight men</a> (Subreddit page, NSFW)</li>
</ul>
<u>Other links:</u>
<ul>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2IoFDLm">The Erotic Mind</a></em>, by Jack Morin (book)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2rr3IHA">Perv</a>,</em> by Jesse Bering (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2rvf5xw"><em>Modern Sexuality</em></a>, by Michael Aaron (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2KJ988D"><em>Sexual Outsiders: Understanding BSM Sexualities</em></a>, by David Ortmann and Richard Sprott (book)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://amzn.to/2jDd52q"><em>Rewriting the Rules</em></a>, by Meg John Barker (book)</li>
 	<li><em><a href="https://amzn.to/2K2GJcT">50 Shades of Grey</a></em>, by E.L. James (novel)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tristan_Taormino">Tristan Taormino</a> (feminist author)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Janet_Hardy">Janet Hardy</a> (sex educator)</li>
 	<li><a href="https://fetlife.com/">FetLife</a> (social networking for kinky people)</li>
 	<li><a href="http://altsexnycconference.org/">AltSex NYC</a> (conference)</li>
 	<li><a href="http://www.manhattanalternative.com/">Manhattan Alternative</a> (sex-positive therapist coalition)</li>
</ul>
<em>The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album <a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">Lu</a><a href="https://cedarsvt.bandcamp.com/album/lumber">mber</a>.</em>

<b>Note</b>: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </content:encoded>
                                    <enclosure url="https://episodes.castos.com/deviate/Deviate-028-Pitagora.mp3" length=""
                        type="audio/mpeg">
                    </enclosure>
                                <itunes:summary>
                    <![CDATA["My specializations come from who I am. I'm a little unusual in the therapy field because I state very clearly what my identifications are. Which is that I'm kinky, and that I'm poly, and that I identify as queer, and that I'm gender fluid, and that I'm a former sex worker." --Dulcinea Pitagora

Dulcinea Pitagora (@KinkDoctor) is a New York-based psychotherapist specializing in alternative sexuality. She is the host of the web series Kink Doctor.

In this episode of Deviate, Rolf and Dulcinea discuss the specifics of dominatrix work (2:00); the difficulties and hurdles involved with dominatrix and other sex work (25:00); Dulcinea's personal path into sex work and sex therapy (31:00); sex therapy and alternative sexualities (47:00); and Fifty Shades of Grey and public perceptions of kink (1:00:00).

For more on Dulcinea, check out http://www.dulcineapitagora.com

Sex terms dicussed:

 	Cisgender (gender identity)
 	Non-binary/gender fluidity (gender identity)
 	Pain play (sex practice)
 	Role play (sex practice)
 	BDSM/power exchange (sex practice)
 	Vanilla (sex behavior)
 	Kink (sex behavior)
 	Safe word (BDSM communication)
 	Fetish (sexual fixation)
 	Polyamory (relationship practice)
 	"Pegging" for straight men (Subreddit page, NSFW)

Other links:

 	The Erotic Mind, by Jack Morin (book)
 	Perv, by Jesse Bering (book)
 	Modern Sexuality, by Michael Aaron (book)
 	Sexual Outsiders: Understanding BSM Sexualities, by David Ortmann and Richard Sprott (book)
 	Rewriting the Rules, by Meg John Barker (book)
 	50 Shades of Grey, by E.L. James (novel)
 	Tristan Taormino (feminist author)
 	Janet Hardy (sex educator)
 	FetLife (social networking for kinky people)
 	AltSex NYC (conference)
 	Manhattan Alternative (sex-positive therapist coalition)

The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel's 2017 album Lumber.

Note: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we're happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.]]>
                </itunes:summary>
                                                                            <itunes:duration>01:17:27</itunes:duration>
                                                    <itunes:author>
                    <![CDATA[Rolf Potts]]>
                </itunes:author>
                            </item>
            </channel>
</rss>
